Shower tray former: tiles and waste height

DazJWood · Dec 6, 2019

Hi,

I have installed a shower former; the type that is a foam core sandwiched by a meshed cement layer either side:

The mosiacs that I wanted to install will be lower than the drain surround (even with the adhesive).

I have included some pictures below of the mosiac layed next to the drain:

The board to board joins and board to former will be tanked shortly.

I was intending to fix them with a 6mm notched trowel but now I have offered them up to the drain it's clear that they won't be level with the top of the drain surround.

Can I still use these mosiacs? Should I use a thicker bed of adhesive?
Would I be better to use full tiles and cut them to the fall of the tray (envelope cut)?

I would be grateful for any advice anyone can offer.

Many thanks in advance,

Daz

Tony_C · Dec 6, 2019

Hi Dan, have you checked the minimum tile size for that brand of tray? Most can only take down to 50x50mm for point loading issues. There are brands than go go lower but its something I'd be checking also which may help sway you towards larger tiles

DazJWood · Dec 6, 2019

Thanks for the response Tony.

The documentation that came with the tray does not describe any restrictions on tile size or point load information. In fact it says nothing about tiling onto it at all. I've checked the manufacturer's website (nassboards.co.uk) and there is no information that I can find on there either. The tray I've got is also not on there.

I can ring them up on Monday and ask for their advice.

Any further advice, in the mean time, based on any experience of a similar issue, would be gratefully received.

Thanks,

Daz

Dumbo · Dec 6, 2019

DazJWood said:
Thanks for the response Tony.

The documentation that came with the tray does not describe any restrictions on tile size or point load information. In fact it says nothing about tiling onto it at all. I've checked the manufacturer's website (nassboards.co.uk) and there is no information that I can find on there either. The tray I've got is also not on there.

I can ring them up on Monday and ask for their advice.

Any further advice, in the mean time, based on any experience of a similar issue, would be gratefully received.

Thanks,

Daz

When you phone them up and ask for their advice regarding tile size get them to email their limitations so if it goes wrong you have something in writing.
Don't use a bigger notch trowel the adhesive will just come through the joints .
You could may be consider overboarding the tray with a 4 or 6 backer board if they are ok with point loading issues

DazJWood · Dec 6, 2019

jcrtiling said:
When you phone them up and ask for their advice regarding tile size get them to email their limitations so if it goes wrong you have something in writing.
Don't use a bigger notch trowel the adhesive will just come through the joints .
You could may be consider overboarding the tray with a 4 or 6 backer board if they are ok with point loading issues

Thanks, will ask them.

Over boarding with backer board? How would I maintain the fall to the drain if I did that? Envelope cut them?

Dumbo · Dec 6, 2019

DazJWood said:
Thanks, will ask them.

Over boarding with backer board? How would I maintain the fall to the drain if I did that? Envelope cut them?

Yes and tape the joints

DazJWood · Dec 6, 2019

jcrtiling said:
Yes and tape the joints

Surely I couldn't just envelope cut a whole backer board. Wouldn't I need to cut the board up to a smaller size as well? A whole board just envelope cut wouldn't follow the fall of the former surely.

Dumbo · Dec 6, 2019

DazJWood said:
Surely I couldn't just envelope cut a whole backer board. Wouldn't I need to cut the board up to a smaller size as well? A whole board just envelope cut wouldn't follow the fall of the former surely.

Of you were fixing xxl tiles you would just envelope cut one tile , so why not

DazJWood · Dec 6, 2019

jcrtiling said:
Of you were fixing xxl tiles you would just envelope cut one tile , so why not

Would the mosiacs then fix over the enveloped cut backer boards ok (where the diagonals are) ?

J K Tiling Cornwall · Dec 7, 2019

Just an idea but could not not stick mosaic mesh sheets to the former and trowel over with adhesive? Will make the base pretty solid and will follow the fall/fleet.. Then fit the mosaics as normal fixed to mosaic mesh. Not sure if 2 layers would be enough? Should get over any point loading issues and will achieve a 100% bed.

DazJWood · Dec 7, 2019

J K Tiling Cornwall said:
Just an idea but could not not stick mosaic mesh sheets to the former and trowel over with adhesive? Will make the base pretty solid and will follow the fall/fleet.. Then fit the mosaics as normal fixed to mosaic mesh. Not sure if 2 layers would be enough? Should get over any point loading issues and will achieve a 100% bed.

Think I understand what you mean.

Do you mean the rigid plastic mesh sheets that are about 30 by 30?

Do you mean stick these to the tile former and then level them with adhesive? Can you elaborate?

Thanks,

Daz

jobdone · Dec 7, 2019

How does the tray sit with the rest of the floor. Raising all the tray will effect the floor height.

J K Tiling Cornwall · Dec 7, 2019

Yep those are the ones a plastic mesh 30x30cm. They are self adhesive, really sticky with wax paper you peel off. I'd make sure the former is really clean, free from dust. If you adhere them to the surface then fill the voids flush with adhesive using a plastering trowel or rigid grout float. Let it go off then tile as normal but use mosaic mesh also on the back of the mosaics. Hopefully with 2 layers you should be close to the height but if not you could double up the layer on the former. In response to Jobdone I'm guessing you only have mosaics in the wet area? What tiles do you have on the rest of the floor? Thanks

DazJWood · Dec 7, 2019

jobdone said:
How does the tray sit with the rest of the floor. Raising all the tray will effect the floor height.

No the tray is installed on a raised framework so no problem with matching height of former and tiles to floor.

DazJWood · Dec 7, 2019

J K Tiling Cornwall said:
Yep those are the ones a plastic mesh 30x30cm. They are self adhesive, really sticky with wax paper you peel off. I'd make sure the former is really clean, free from dust. If you adhere them to the surface then fill the voids flush with adhesive using a plastering trowel or rigid grout float. Let it go off then tile as normal but use mosaic mesh also on the back of the mosaics. Hopefully with 2 layers you should be close to the height but if not you could double up the layer on the former. In response to Jobdone I'm guessing you only have mosaics in the wet area? What tiles do you have on the rest of the floor? Thanks

Great thanks for replying. Yes that sounds like a reasonable way of raising the height and keeping the fall. Thanks for the suggestion.

Still seems strange that the drain height is so high considering mosiacs are used a lot in shower floor installations.

I'll ring the manufactured Monday for their recommendations but the mesh idea sounds good as a solution.

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