Concrete floor with plywood around radiator pipes (mixed substrate)

[barrybaz]

Hi

Apologies for what i'm sure is a pretty obvious question:

I'm about to do my second ever tiling job - the kitchen of our new-ish build flat (built 2002).

On taking up the old vinyl tiles I found that the floor around the radiator pipes is plywood - level with the concrete. Each piece of wood is about 10cm x 25cm.

The tiles are large format porcelain (1200x600mm) and, on the advice of BAL I'd bought Bal Stone & Tile PTB.

I've had a number of conflicting bits of advice for how to handle the different surfaces:

1. BAL technical advice said I'd need an expansion joint and probably Ditra matting.

2. Topps Tiles said I wouldn't need any Ditra matting or expansion joint - that it was fine just to tile directly over the wood because I'm using a flexible adhesive.

3. Another tiling shop (from which I'm buying the tiles) said I wouldn't need Ditra mat but would need Bal Admix AD1 at a 1:3 ratio for the wooden section.

4. Schluter said I'd need Ditra matting through the whole kitchne.

Any advice? I'm planning to prime the floor after clearing the glue properly with SBR primer. The kitchen is approx 3m x 4m in size.

Really would appreciate your expert guidance!

 

[Andy Allen]

Re: Concrete floor with plywood around radiator pipes (mixed substrate

ive had this a few times...providing its well fixed I would just tile over it..

 

[Rookery]

Re: Concrete floor with plywood around radiator pipes (mixed substrate

I'm with Andy. My own cynical view of the advice given is:
1. BAL obviously hedging their bets
2. Technical advice from Topps :lol:
3. Not particularly wrong
4. Well Schluter would say that
If the 10" x 4" pieces of ply are loose, take them out and fill the void with some rapid set.

 

[Qwerty]

Re: Concrete floor with plywood around radiator pipes (mixed substrate

You could always use something like mapetex over the wood areas (a few inches longer and wider). I have done this before

 

[barrybaz]

Re: Concrete floor with plywood around radiator pipes (mixed substrate

Hi guys - thanks so much for the advice. All sounds great and really is much appreciated.

The ply seems pretty solid and is screwed down.

Do you think the Mapetex would make for problems with uneven height or is it ok?

Can't seem to get a picture to upload here but I've posted one of the kitchen floor here: tinypic.com/view.php?pic=2rhv1wp&s=8#.VFqyKFOsW2w

Thanks again for your advice - hugely grateful..

 

[Dave]

Re: Concrete floor with plywood around radiator pipes (mixed substrate

Option 4 for me, tiled one like that before , ply sections in screed for pipes fitted afterwards .. Best to make sure than chance it IMHO.

 

[barrybaz]

Re: Concrete floor with plywood around radiator pipes (mixed substrate

David - just to check you mean my option #4 (Ditra over the whole floor)?

Do you have a thought about my using Mapetex as was suggested earlier?

I'm a bit worried about increasing the overall height of the floor and it seems that the Mapetex solution would have less of an impact?

 

[Qwerty]

To be honest, the Ditra route is the safest bet as Dave says. And no, the height difference with mapetex is very little so just adjust the adhesive bed depth accordingly

 

[barrybaz]

Re: Concrete floor with plywood around radiator pipes (mixed substrate

Thanks all for your advice - really much appreciated.

One last question: rather than using the Ditra lining do you think would it be more cost effective / simpler for me just to pop out the plywood and fill in the void with cement then prime and use self-levelling compound over the whole floor before tiling?

Many thanks again.

 

[Andy Allen]

Re: Concrete floor with plywood around radiator pipes (mixed substrate

Ditra would be belt and braces approach. ..
However its only a 10 cm channel and I've just tiled over this kind of thing many times using flexible adhesive and have had no issues...but its your choice.

filling with cement would be another option to consider...

 

[barrybaz]

Re: Concrete floor with plywood around radiator pipes (mixed substrate

Thanks guys - really appreciate you taking the time to respond!

 

[prceramics]

Re: Concrete floor with plywood around radiator pipes (mixed substrate

i would give the customer all options and let then make up there mind and say they could keep a few extra tiles if they need to be raplaced in the future, at an extra cost naturaly.

 

[Simon benn Leeds]

Re: Concrete floor with plywood around radiator pipes (mixed substrate

I'm with Andy. My own cynical view of the advice given is:
1. BAL obviously hedging their bets
2. Technical advice from Topps :lol:
3. Not particularly wrong
4. Well Schluter would say that
If the 10" x 4" pieces of ply are loose, take them out and fill the void with some rapid set.

Love number 2!...haha ha

 

[Simon benn Leeds]

For what it is I'd tile over it, if it's next to the radiators I imagine there won't be a lot of foot traffic anyway, I use an adhesive called benferflex C2 which in a non rapid fibre reinforced highly thixotropic adhesive which can be used directly onto wooden boards, (personally I seem to use flexible on pretty much all flooring, only a pound or two more per bag).

Also can I just ask, are you confident installing 1200x600s on your 2nd tiling job??.
Not easy for the seasoned tiler

 

[Simon benn Leeds]

Just seen the thread date!.... Ha ha doylum!.. I'd sure hope it was done now. Be interesting to find out how he got on tho.

 

[Dave]

I hope it's been tiled by now ..

 

[barrybaz]

Cheers lads. Yes - tiled now and looks great. Thanks again for the advice! I put on a few coats of primer. No problems so far but bought a couple of extra tiles as a precaution... 1200x600mm tiles were a bit of a handful in the end but look good.. Will report back if any cracks appear in case it helps anyone else looking back at this thread. So far so good.

 

[Old Mod]

Cheers lads. Yes - tiled now and looks great. Thanks again for the advice! I put on a few coats of primer. No problems so far but bought a couple of extra tiles as a precaution... 1200x600mm tiles were a bit of a handful in the end but look good.. Will report back if any cracks appear in case it helps anyone else looking back at this thread. So far so good.

Kool!
Any photos of floor?.

 

[Qwerty]

Yes, do share!

 

[p4ulo]

So what approach did you use in the end @barrybaz ?? Cheers.
Oh yeah, phots!!

 

[Simon benn Leeds]

Love it when a tread comes alive!.., ha