First private Job

[henrywillicombe]

Hello everyone. This forum has been really educational and id like to thank everyone that shares their knowledge on this forum. I have been tiling for two years for someone else and have my first solo job coming up. I want this job to be of the highest standard, run as smoothly as possible and earn some good money from it. My priorities are in that order.
The job is 28 sq metres of marble floor. 600 x 400 tiles in brick bond. the substrate is floor boards that have been fixed down and supported and i couldnt see any signs of deflection, and in the the next room is old concrete screed. The builders are going to sbr the floor and then latex it. I am putting ditra down with Bal rapid set. I have a few question and would be grateful for answers. at work i have always been told to mix two adhesive together. for example i know u need a rapid set adhesive for stone but to aid laying we would mix a bag of each together, i.e dunlop normal setting and fast setting. and the ratio would vary on how weather, how much is needed, etc. usually 1:1 or 2:1. I have since read on here that this is bad practise, so i would like to know of an adhesive that is rapid setting but is nice to work with. i get discount in tile flair and mandarin so would have to be from these stores.
i am going to order the stone and will be ordering 31 sq metres is this enough. and finally i am going to seal the tiles with MP90, would u wax the tiles afterwards as is the norm with stone, as i have read conflicting reports. I am experianced with stone as that is the bulk of the work we do but havent worked with marble before. Any help would be brilliant.
P.S ive allowed for six days at the same rate my boss pays me. i would like do do it in less time but would rather take longer do a good job and make less money. How long would it take some of you more experianced lads.

 

[suave]

:welcome:

 

[Rich]

Hello and welcome to the forum, very glad that we have been of some help. First off best of luck with it

I wouldn't mix the adhesives together, use a adhesive that is nice to work with. I couldn't recommend Mapei enough, their Keraquick is lovely stuff to work with, rapid setting but very usable.

I would also be unhappy with the builders SLC before I tiled, I am yet to see a builder do it properly or leave a finish that is anywhere near flat. I would much rather do this myself as the floor will meed to be completely flat if you are laying in brick bond but that is down to you.

Does the screeded floor and the floor boards meet? Are you planning to Ditra the entire area or just over the floorboards?

 

[henrywillicombe]

i advised the woman that i would prefer to slc the floor myself but the builders were already booked in for monday. I dont want to steal peoples work so i just hope they do a good job. the floor looked quite flat when i looked at it. i am going to ditra the whole floor. they meet and the majority of the floor is wood so might as well cover the whole area. any suggestions on the wax and sealer mate.

 

[Mike]

are they putting the slc onto the floor boards? i would put a backer board down at least, prior to slc

 

[Perry]

substrate is floor boards that have been fixed down and supported ?

 

[henrywillicombe]

New floor boards. extra noggins put in and then fixed. This is what ive been told.

 

[Perry]

you mean you are going to tile direct to the floorboards ?

 

[kilty55]

slc poured onto floorboards? my 1st priority would be to double and triple check this

if it is the case i wouldnt do the job

also dont mix adhesives....cant see why you would gain anything from that

sounds a decent job but you will have to check that substrate 1st with the builders and customer direct

 

[chille]

can you do it in 6 days? do you have insurance? what guarantee will you offer? and can you honour it? under cutting your boss is fine so long as you are willing to stick ones neck on the line. IMHO doing it at the rates you are paid is only giving the client a cheap job, you get nothing out of it. If it goes well great but if not then the poop hits the fan. good luck

 

[henrywillicombe]

6 days is more than enough in my opinion to do this job. i should do it in less. The client is a friend of my girlfriend. im doing it cheaper so as to do her a favour and not put pressure on myself to work faster and justify my price. i am putting ditra down on top of the slc which is on top of the floor boards. Not ideal as i would like to have it plyed or boarded. i thought it would be okay as i have done the same on jobs that have been run by so called architects and as i said the floor boards are solid. I want this job to be proper so shall i say is has to be boarded or plyed. I have no insurance but will do everything i can to fix any problems but will do my best to make sure none come up. the builder is a close friend of hers and i find it dificult to slag of peoples methods to the customers when in the real world i have seen a lot worse done by so called architects. being asked to schluter 90m of porcelain, let the underfloor heating go on top slc it and then tile the floor is one example that springs to mind. i am competent at tiling stone and wanted to share my job with this forum and see what peoples opinions were in terms of waxing marble. Some replys seem a bit negative, wish i hadnt bothered.

 

[The Legend; Phil Hobson RIP]

Hi and welcome, I'm sorry you feel some members reply's seem negative, but they are giving their advice free of charge, if you don't want to listen then good luck. I see on average one job per month, that has failed due to bad practice. Not good for this industry

 

[kilty55]

hi henry i didnt mean to come across negative but my points were about things i wouldnt advise doing

you have asked for advice after all

like i said sounds a good jobif you can speak and over board,just nto something iw ould do is slc direct to boards

 

[henrywillicombe]

i said I would say it has to be overboarded if thats what has to be done. and i stated i wanted to do this job as well as possible so why would i not listen. I only usually turn up and lay none of the prep is done by me. Thats why i have come on here to check if my method was right. so what is the cheapest way to sort this out as i will have to do this out of my money as i dont want to be accused of putting hidden extras on.

 

[kilty55]

so you are going to pay out your own pocket to over board someone elses floor

my advice is you aproach this job from start again,,,i wouldnt suggest paying for 28 metres of cement boards or ply out your own pocket,youll be on a hiding to nothing

as advised speak to the client is my advice and advise them the correct way to do the job,other wise you cannot guarantee it

 

[kilty55]

as you said ask client to get the builders to over board the floor 1st then level it would be much better but dont pay for it yourself

 

[Time's Ran Out]

:welcome: Henry - What do you think might happen with up to 2 ton of marble on tongue and groove floorboards. There might be no deflection now but Ditra isn't going to absorb the bounce and when the friend of your girlfriend isn't a friend any more, what cover will you offer in compensation.



Note : This post is typed with the OP interest at heart. Any comments given are not meant to upset, offend, or cause any feelings of negativity.

 

[White Room]

Hi and welcome..

 

[Perry]

architects know little about a lot where we know a lot about a little this is where the problems lie

 

[henrywillicombe]

ive sent my price to the client with a strong recomendation to overboad the floor before it is latexed. This is because ive listened to you guys and respect your opinion. ive rang two builders one is a chippie and foreman for a big building company. the other is a chippie and known to be a very good one, both said the floor would be more than adequate. i know both well and know them to always try and do the best job possible and they are very strict on their sub contractors. so why is it not more common knowledge to overboard the the floor first. both said that the schluter stooped the need for ply.
has anyone got a link of of british standards or something similar so i have something to back up my argument. doing a job badly by accident when your trying to do a good job is really something that doesnt need to happen.

 

[paul damian]

Hi henry, it is upsetting that you feel " you shouldnt of bothered" all these lads on here have been through the learning journey and have learnt from their mistakes ,me included, they would not advise you to do something wrong.Floorboards and ditra then tiles is a no-no. I have never recieved the wrong advice on here and you will never find a better place to learn with these bunch of lads.IF you did a course to learn about tiling you would have to pay for it, its free on here these lads give their time to help you. Hope fully you will take this the right way.

 

[Perry]

rang two builders one is a chippie and foreman for a big building company does that mean they also know about cars aircraft tiling ? no i dont think so or they wouldent be giving you that advise and the guy you have been working for as a tiler for two years should be able to tell you that if not i would look for a new job not trying to be rude but trying to help

 

[henrywillicombe]

i want to do a proper job. this is the first time ive had to do any prep. I want to do it properly. i was planning on taking pictures of every stage of the job and giving it to the customer so that she could see exactly what ive done and know ive done a good job. My boss would also tile on floor boards with ditra and thinks ditra is a substitute for ply, when i started this job it was under impression my boss was a brilliant tiler as he gets loads of work and his jobs always look good. I have basically learnt from him and am now learning that i may of been misinformed. I want to be as good as possible so may have to look into a tiling course. every job we get is a nightmare to do. i.e plastered walls that are not flat, or tiling on a screed that is uneven or level etc all our jobs take ages because we are basically rendering the walls with adhesive then sticking tiles on them. My boss is a good bloke but i get the impression he doesnt know much about preparation but thinks he does. i dont think he is intentionally doing a bad job or i wouldnt work for him. i have only known one job go wrong and that is a kitchen floor done before i worked for him. he cancelled going on a stag do and relaid the whole floor for free. ive joined this forum to be a better. Also ive rang MANDARIN stone and tile giant to ask about laying marble tiles on schluter straight on floor boards. Both said it was ok and tile giant said if i used Mapei 2 part adhesive it would be guaranteed for 25 years. i made it clear it was tongue and groove and they both said it was ok. easy to see how mistakes are made.

 

[White Room]

Floor boards in old victorian houses are rock solid, floor boards in some from the houses in the 70's tend to have a habit having curly edges and are thin and are no way suitible to ditra and tile on....can't believe there saying it's ok though.

 

[bobbynz]

Floor boards in old victorian houses are rock solid, floor boards in some from the houses in the 70's tend to have a habit having curly edges and are thin and are no way suitible to ditra and tile on....can't believe there saying it's ok though.

I think the confusion for someone with limited knowledge is hearing advice from someone with years of practical advice and comparing that with the tds of any product. The thing is, we know that sometimes if you do it based on tech info from manufacturer, you might have a failure simply because they cannot possibly test product under every possible scenario. However, if you want to reduce the chance of failure, then you listen to the guys who produce an installation that they would want in their own homes.
Its the years of experience they have that tells them that the tech sheets for the products they use are limited to what the manufacturer wants their product to do and not what it actually does in the real world.:yikes: