Grout Advice Required

[kinhell]

I have a shower tray with 4 inches of tile all the way around almost flat to make the shower enclosure larger than the tray. I noticed downstairs in the garage it was leaking and removed the plaster board to find it must have been leaking for a while. I haven't time to take the tray out and tank etc. So I've got the grout out of the tiles using a dremel grout removing bit. Non of the grout was soft (Actually it was very hard). The only reason it may have leaked was hairline cracks in the grout on one side. Obviously some movement when I get my 18st body in the shower !:yes:

What I would like to know is whats the best sort of grout to use so that I can avoid hairline cracks. Flexible grout? If so which particular make is best?

 

[DHTiling]

A flexible grout is best..but try using Silicon the it will keep the water out....make sure the joints are dry......

p.s. tanking will stop it but try Silicon first....And it would be advisable to replace the Silicon joint all the way around the shower etc etc.....cover all avenues first....

 

[grumpygrouter]

Hi kinhell, welcome to thr forums. I will need to think about what you are descibibg there for a while so that I may understand better what you are saying. Only 4inches of tile in your shower?

Grumpy

PS could you say hello in the New Members forum and tell us a bit about yourself. Sort of a formal introduction, if you know what I mean.
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OK just dawned on me what you meant. Sorry, it has been a long day!

Are you sure that is where it is leaking from?

Grumpy

 

[kinhell]

Yes it is. Did a nice little test with red shampoo and worked my way around the tray over a few days. 2 places where there were cracks it leaked. Silicon is an option but wondered if flexible grout would be the better solution. IF so what make etc.

 

[DHTiling]

All grout except epoxy will allow water to penetrate it...that's why i mentioned the Silicon...but if you want a good brand of flexi grout the use BAL super flex grout for that amount of grouting....Your local branch of CTD will supply that no probs....

 

[kinhell]

Thanks for the info. Under what circumstance would you use epoxy grout?

 

[DHTiling]

Hospitals.....commercial kitchens...and exactly on a job like yours....BAL do one called easypoxy...

BAL Easypoxy

Hygienic, impervious epoxide resin based ceramic tile grout specifically formulated to resist chemical attack and to provide a durable, abrasion-resistant, waterproof finish. The cured grout does not transfer taints to foodstuffs or permit the entry of bacteria or dirt and is easily maintained in a sterile condition. Also suitable as a high performance epoxy adhesive for fixing ceramic tiles, on walls, floors, and worktops in interior and exterior situations. Especially suited for use in bakeries, breweries, restaurants, dairies, kitchens, medical practices and industrial plant rooms.

BAL Easypoxy meets the requirements of BS 5980:1980 for resistance to mould growth. It also conforms to BS 5385😛art 4:1992:section 9, for use in sterile conditions. The product additionally meets the requirements of “The Materials and Articles in Contact with Food Regulations 1987”, “The Food Safety (General Food Hygiene) Regulations 1995” and the EC Directive 93/43 on the Hygiene of Foodstuffs 1993. Conforms to BS EN 13888, Type R, Class G1.
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Good luck mate.............

 

[kinhell]

Cheers for the info. From what your saying the epoxy would be better because it doesn't let water penetrate but what about hairline cracks?

 

[White Room]

Used epoxy for my own shower it's been there for year's and still look's good

 

[kinhell]

Sounds good to me. I'll get some epoxy. I 've read its a right pain to use. Any tips so that I can avoid and problems?

 

[mz30]

Hi
From you original post your shower tray is four inche's smaller than your shower screen and you have tiled around the edge of the tray to meet the screen?

If that's the case no amount of grout/Silicon or epoxy is going to stop that shower leaking.

 

[kinhell]

Sorry if I wasn't clearer. The shower is a walkin one with 3 sides tiled. The tray does not reach the sides and approx 4 inches of tiles all around take it up to the wall. So do you not think the epoxy grout would do the job?

 

[DHTiling]

The only other problem that needs addressing as well is..if the water has damaged the substrate under these tiles..thus causing them to de-bond.....apart from that it can be repaired.....

 

[mz30]

Before i could give any advice ,i am assuming that if it's a walk in shower it has a low level (flat on the floor)tray?

If it has, is the tiling sitting on the tray or sitting flush to the edge?

Can you post a picture so i could give my opinion?

 

[kinhell]

During taking the grout out one of the tiles lifted up. Underneath the wood was rotten and soaking wet. So I've managed to get all the tiles up intact and removed all the rotting wood etc. letting it dry out now.

Here's a couple of pictures of it.
http://i180.photobucket.com/albums/x102/satinagra/DSCF0161.jpg

http://i180.photobucket.com/albums/x102/satinagra/DSCF0160.jpg

As you might notice the right one side has been filled in with mortar and seems to be intact and dry.
What i found was that the water had penetrated the addhesive on the front, left and back.

What would be the best solution for this ?
I've thought about filling the rest with mortar and adding something that makes it completely waterproof.
Any other ideas would be appreciated along with what adhesive and grout to use.

 

[DHTiling]

I would replace all the timber with aqua panel or similar....Has the water ingression not travelled up the walls ...?..

 

[kinhell]

The water seems to have gone up the plaster board in small areas about 2 inches and seems to be drying out today. In the back wall I have access and felt the plasterboard and its not wet.

How would I use the aqua panel in this situation not having used it before?

 

[DHTiling]

The timber that i can see in the sides..is this solid timber framing or play overlay..?..if its an overlay then re-move this and replace with aqua panel...if it is solid framing then it is a bigger job to do...

 

[mz30]

I would have to concur with dave(about using aquaboard).
It's the best chance in a bad situation.


I have seen this sort of thing on numerous occasion's and regardless of the fix the chances of that shower ever being totally waterproof are very slim ,aqua board or not.

 

[kinhell]

The timber you can see around the sides is the flooring. There was 3 x2 timber there but rotten through.

Just to understand what you are saying, should I fill in the gap up level with the top of the tray and put lengths of aqua panel on top sloping gently inwards towards the centre of the tray? If so what would be the best thing to fill the gap with, mortar like the right side with a waterproofing agent?

 

[DHTiling]

I would remove the bottom row of tiles all the way around then build up the sides with aqua panel and flexi adhesive..then tank the aqua panel and the bottom bit of the walls...once dry then when you re-tile..let the tiles over shoot onto the tray a bit and seal the front lip with Silicon....the tanking and overshooting the tiles should stop any further probs.....nothings 100% but its worth a go....
Use cement based addy all the way and then no water will affect it...
But it is all in the prep work if you want to stop this happening again...

 

[kinhell]

Many thanks for the advice. I've learned over the years that taking your time and making sure the job is done correctly and right first time usually prevents further problems. Cheers.