How much work involved in taking up badly fitted tiles?

[MissH]

I did an experiment earlier and put a tile in the sink for just an hour ( I don't have a big enough bucket!). Was able to flake off the adhesive with a wall paper scraper and hammer...came off in quite big pieces and it seemed quite soft but would be hard work doing all of 106 of them I think. Plus not sure what I'd do if there's not enough due to cutting and waste etc once they're re-laid. I'm sure I wouldn't be able to match them after this time.

I like your tablecloth idea Bob Hey presto!

Seriously though so far by the looks of things the job has been done incorrectly on the following counts:-
1) 4mm ply used instead of 15mm and ply just screwed not glued as well.
2) Vinyl tiles left and boarded over - should have been removed.
2) Ply not taken up to edge of room leading to cracking of tiles.
3) Floor not marked up correctly leading to veering off at the other side of the room
4) Wrong mix of adhesive used - mixture too powdery
5) Adhesive not applied correctly and not enough used for suffiecient grab in places
5) Too small spacers used leading to differing widths between tiles.
6) Grout not mixed correctly and accurately leading to different colours.

I might just email the builder ( he's still trading!) and see what he says. Worth a try anyway!

 

[John Benton]

If you still have his details it may be worth mailing him just to prick his conscience, if he has one, attach the pictures as well. I'd be surprised if you get any response. Where did you get the tiles from originally? It's possible that they still do them even after this length of time and you could possibly take one of the tiles taken up to colour match and size.

 

[Alan M]

worth a try going back to the tile shop.
i did that for a small job i did. managed to get tiles that were down 10 years at least. god only knows how he found them after this time. all i wanted was something close enough for a splash back . he even gave them to me free. probably knew he couldnt sell them and wanted rid. . very nice of him thow. always good to repeat customers

 

[doug boardley]

I always leave tiles behind the kickboard in a kitchen, with all the relevant info from the box they came in, a lot of tlers do this for customers future reference.

 

[John Benton]

Me also Doug, I think this was mentioned in the recent thread about how many actual m2 you charge for when fitting. Try to leave a good few tiles to cover any future breaks etc.

 

[MissH]

The tiles were just ones from B & Q (Africa Black 330 x 330), I've got 12 left in the garage in the box with name etc. He used another spare 26 believe it or not to replace the tiles where the grout had cracked around the week after he'd done the tiling! (They're still in my garden - I just counted them). I think I ordered more at the time as I thought the kitchen would go over the tiles...though now I know it's the other way round! Have looked on the B & Q site and I don't think they do them any more anyway.

Anyway, wishing you all Happy New Year!

 

[MissH]

Hi guys
Sorry not been around to post for a bit, but just thought I’dupdate you on the latest with the tiling situation. I did write to the builderand actually sent him a video clip which showed in great detail his “workmanship”.I also mentioned the 1982 Goods and Services act which states that “allservices must be undertaken with reasonable care and skill”. He replied (inwriting as I’d insisted on) saying that he had recommended thicker ply butbecause I didn’t want a “step” into the living room ( it would have been 0.9cm)we agreed on the 5mm. This is not the case and we did not have the discussion,0.9 cm would have been more than acceptable rather than cracking tiles) Iremember that we only agreed that he would board with ply which appeared to be correctto myself as a layperson. I had no idea until reading these forums that 15mmply are needed! Should he as a professional not have undertaken the job if Ihad insisted on 5mm (which I didn’t I hasten to add!)? I guess it would have been like me insistingthat a new boiler does not have a flue because it doesn’t look nice!) In hisreply he also said that he’d replaced 3 or 4 tiles which of course he hadn’tand he’d replaced 31 (I recounted the onesI still have, ( I was going to try and reuse them) . The whole kitchen was 133tiles so that’s a big proportion. I’veattached some more photos of the tiles he replaced showing the very little amountof adhesive on some of them and the fact they are all whole apart from onestill whole is telling that the correct bond was not established. The adhesiveis weak and and thin under some of the tiles and can be crumble to dust in myhand. In places it only measures 2mm thick – not even enough to keep wall tilesup let alone floor tiles!

I got a pro tiler in to have a look and he was prettyshocked at the work L.He also said the screws weren’t close enough together at 30cm instead of 15cmand it was basically “all wrong”. He also mentioned about the 6mm ply ( not 5mm proving that adiscussion around 5mm ply did not take place!) He seems to know what he’stalking about and verified that the floor was tileable ( I’d thought aboutgetting wood when I redo the kitchen as I’m so scared of it happening again)but he guaranteed that tiles would not move once he’d put them down properly! I’veseen photos of his work which looks great and he’s giving me references as wellif he gets the job. However, I will definitely get a written guarantee as wellnext time! Do you tilers carry insurance for jobs going wrong and should I insist on seeing certificates etc?

Will see what the original person who did the floor comesback with. I’ve mentioned all the pro tiler’s points in my letter. Would begood if I could get some feedback on the photos showing the adhesive though...

Cheers!
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[Mike]

i can't open the attatchments? i have liability insurance (as most will have too) which covers damage to third party property but i don't think there's an insurance to cover for shoddy workmanship.

 

[John Benton]

i can't open the attatchments? i have liability insurance (as most will have too) which covers damage to third party property but i don't think there's an insurance to cover for shoddy workmanship.

Me neither can't open them. Could it be possible that the finished floor is not 'fit for purpose' Mike?

 

[Mike]

Me neither can't open them. Could it be possible that the finished floor is not 'fit for purpose' Mike?

sound very much like it john. it needs a total rip out i.m.o. but sounds like the 'tiler' is trying to get out of it. could well be a case for the small claims court

 

[MissH]

Hi again,

Ah the page went a bit strange after I'd posted! Will try to repost pics...thanks for quick replies though as ever!

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[kilty55]

hi is the floor being re boarded with an appropriate alternative this time,,are your re using these tiles?

 

[bobbynz]

"I’veseen photos of his work which looks great and he’s giving me references as wellif he gets the job. However, I will definitely get a written guarantee as wellnext time! Do you tilers carry insurance for jobs going wrong and should I insist on seeing certificates etc?"

Its called a license certificate. But unfortunately the Tiling/Building industry doesn't register TRAINED Tilers. Besides he is a builder isn't he. It would be in your best interests to get a Tiler for this job. This builder probably does a good job building but a Tiler he is not.
This is a prime example of why Tilers need to be trained and licensed. Even a 6 month apprentice could tell you what this guy did wrong.
:incazzato:..........:mad2:

 

[MissH]

Hi thanks for replying.

I would accept nothing but 15mm ply base, screwed down at 150mm intervals on flex adhesive of appropriate thickness. Also only a pro tiler with references and portfolio of work!

No, not reusing the tiles, think it would be too much work really for all 133...

 

[MissH]

Hi Bobby,

Thanks for the reply. I absolutley agree - will definitley be a pro tiler when I come to redo it! Or any other tiling jobs for that matter. I didn't know about the licence, who issues them? I think ALL tradesmen/women should have to be officially registered like OFTEC or Gasafe. The certification should show where they were trained and for how long - or enter a name into the website type of thing. It might stop poor work being done (my floor!) and give the professionals such as yourselves more business.

 

[MissH]

Oh yes and I would make him do that glass of water in middle of floor test I read about on here once new ply was fixed down! This site is great for improving your knowledge, I've learned so much about tiling! Thanks all!

 

[Mike]

i would lay cement boards over the ply, a much better substrate to tile on and less chance of failure