polypipe overlay

[ms.tiles]

Hi All

Ive got a nice job to price up but have a few questions that i thought the pro's would be able to help with.
Its 75 sq mtrs of natural stone, one section is water underfloor heating with 75mm screed which i'll advise ditra matting which im alright doing.
The other section is polypipe overlay system. The tiles probably will be limestone flagstone about 15mm thick, its a concrete base and ive read that polypipe say not to stick the thermal boards down, this concerns me as if the floor isnt totally flat and if there is a void below this 18mm thermal board isnt there room for it to collapse and then causing the tile to crack?
Ive been trying to call schluter all day but its always engaged, is there any reason for not slc the boards and putting ditra on top before tiling?
Also polypipe advise 2 part addy is this right or will a spf addy work.

ive tiled onto overlay before but i knew nothing of it and the builder i worked for had screwed it down to a wooden substrate and he supplied ardex x7001 adhesive, i now know hes a cowboy and have told him id never work for him ago, this was over a year ago and ive heard all is well with the floor still.

The room next to it is having a wooden floor put down over polypipe again but the customer wants them both to flow into eachother so no height difference but if im going to lay ditra then the height will be different to no ditra.

Any info would be great

thanks in advance
mark

 

[bugs183]

Is this the system where you put thermal boards down onto an existing floor aand you can tile on top???
I've seen this system on a few jobs, and i may be wrong but in my opinion it will fail.
You can't tile onto a floating surface as the manufacturers say, there's another ufh company selling a similar system, but the pipes are in a flimsy polystyrene board. Their tech guys say loose lay the panels, feed the pipe into into, lay 2 layers of cross bonded 6mm ply over the top, which again is not fixed and then you can tile.
Total tosh!!!
I refuse to go anywhere near these systems, Ditras good, but if there is any movement under it then you will have a failure on your hands.

 

[Spud]

I got asked to price this job Mark and turned it down, polypipe are very vague on their specification so I asked the tile association for their opinion and they said no way ,polypipe need a bullet proof written specification in place in my opinion if you are going to install an £8000 floor over it

 

[bugs183]

I'm glad it's not just me then that thinks these systems are cack!

 

[ms.tiles]

Cheers

Gary was it near Dane end??
I know the plumber installing it,would it be worth asking him to fix the boards down then me slc over the boards then ditra on top.
Does anybody think that would be enough or is it a case of walking away!!
When i spoke to polypipe they said 2 part addy and no slc, this was nearly 18 months ago and im wondering if theyve changed their methods. im going to call them tomorrow and put it to them about not sticking the boards down and ask for an email stating why its ok not to fix them down. Even if i dont do the job it'll be good to post on here for others.
i actually wanted to do the job as the style of the house and the tiles they want would look great but if its that much of a balls ache then i might have to tell her the bad news. The plumber has just started to recommend me for work aswell!
Appreciate the feed back
Mark

 

[Spud]

Cheers

Gary was it near Dane end??
I know the plumber installing it,would it be worth asking him to fix the boards down then me slc over the boards then ditra on top.
Does anybody think that would be enough or is it a case of walking away!!
When i spoke to polypipe they said 2 part addy and no slc, this was nearly 18 months ago and im wondering if theyve changed their methods. im going to call them tomorrow and put it to them about not sticking the boards down and ask for an email stating why its ok not to fix them down. Even if i dont do the job it'll be good to post on here for others.
i actually wanted to do the job as the style of the house and the tiles they want would look great but if its that much of a balls ache then i might have to tell her the bad news. The plumber has just started to recommend me for work aswell!
Appreciate the feed back
Mark

yes, a lovely barn for a nice couple, we tiled their bathroom and ensuite ,they have seen the e-mail from the tile association but are adamant they want to use this polypipe system I have walked away from it as its too much of a risk and I dont want to be kicked out of the tile association

 

[bugs183]

The system has a chance of working if the boards are stuck and screwed down, completely leveled over, then Ditra matted then tiled. If a customer let me do that then i'd think about doing the job, any less and i'll walk away every time.
It's a shame that it's a good job, but in the long run it's better for you and the plumber if you tell him the pitfalls of this installation, doing this wrong will give both of you grief and no one wants that.

 

[Spud]

The system has a chance of working if the boards are stuck and screwed down, completely leveled over, then Ditra matted then tiled. If a customer let me do that then i'd think about doing the job, any less and i'll walk away every time.
It's a shame that it's a good job, but in the long run it's better for you and the plumber if you tell him the pitfalls of this installation, doing this wrong will give both of you grief and no one wants that.

well said

 

[ms.tiles]

Thats the one Gary.
Only met the wife but yes nice lady to deal with. Lovely property aswell and would look lovely.
Ive told her im doing a bit of research into it all and i'll let her know what i think.
As Bugs183 says it might work but its a big cost to do all the extras just to make it secure for tiling.
Thing is somebody will go in there not wanting to do the research and just tile it not caring about later on if the stone starts to crack etc.

 

[Billy Hunt]

Ive got a simillar job comming up for a system called wunda floor or summat and they say you can tile directly over this system with a Mapei two part addy,the name escapes me at the minute but check out the website, reasuring to know they recommend an adhesive though,When I e-mailed polypipe to see what brand they recommend they replied with "A flexible adhesive and grout" Thanks Polypipe for your expertise and knowledge of this matter!

 

[ms.tiles]

I called polypipe today and asked about not sticking the thermal boards down, bloke said if the floor is uneven self level and if the boards are still not level fix them down. no need to slc and ditra mat 6mm hardie backer board should be fine. single part flexible addy and flexible grout,18months ago had to be 2 part addy.
I may do the job but to the specs given by polypipe and put it to the customer any problems and its down to polypipe but I'll explain my fears and what I've learned about it. They might change their minds about it.