Porcelain tiles not sticking to plywood?

[Bill]

Hi

I'm looking for some advice from the experts, as a DIY tiler who's done a few jobs. I've just laid 600x600mm polished porcelain tiles in my hallway. Floor is T&G chipboard and I've over boarded with 15mm exterior plywood, screw-fixed at 300mm centres and fixed tiles using BAL single part flexible adhesive. I sealed back and sides of plywood with BAL SBR bond (as recommended on BAL website). I was running low on adhesive towards the end if the job and added some more adhesive and water to the existing mixed adhesive I had left in the bucket (been in bucket for maybe 3 hours) and the tiles I've fixed using this adhesive are not sticking to the plywood.......is there a problem adding more powder adhesive and water to adhesive which has been mixed for 3 hours or so?

i'm worried that the other tiles that I've laid may not be properly stuck to the plywood? I've been careful not to walk in the tiles for 24 hours......is this long enough to leave them before I walk on them and grout them?

Anyone had problems fixing porcelain floor tiles to plywood using BAL single part flexible?

 

[Stef]

It states you shouldn't add more water to a mix but I've spun my adhesive up & added a bit of water & never had a problem.
Bal spf is a very good adhesive, check the date on the bag incase it's out of date.
Longforgan, take it your just outside Dundee?
Had a few meals in the longforgan inn back in the day..

 

[Time's Ran Out]

Dyslexia set in - I thought it was 'longforgottontiler'.
I've never remixed old adhesive, always use a measuring guide for water volume and have a clean bucket available for each and every mix.:lol:
Still surprises me that people continue to tile direct to a plywood substrate!

 

[Stef]

Dyslexia set in - I thought it was 'longforgottontiler'.
I've never remixed old adhesive, always use a measuring guide for water volume and have a clean bucket available for each and every mix.:lol:
Still surprises me that people continue to tile direct to a plywood substrate!

Well I'm assuming that it's longforgan!!!
Could well be long forgotten!!

 

[Old Mod]

It states you shouldn't add more water to a mix but I've spun my adhesive up & added a bit of water & never had a problem.
Bal spf is a very good adhesive, check the date on the bag incase it's out of date.
Longforgan, take it your just outside Dundee?
Had a few meals in the longforgan inn back in the day..

yeah but u don't do a mix on top do u Stef! U just don't do it, loosening up is one thing, a new mix is completely different. It's the same if u mix a new rapid mix on top of an empty bucket that u've not washed out first surely? Sets it off in no time cos the remains of the original mix activates the new one.

 

[Stef]

yeah but u don't do a mix on top do u Stef! U just don't do it, loosening up is one thing, a new mix is completely different. It's the same if u mix a new rapid mix on top of an empty bucket that u've not washed out first surely? Sets it off in no time cos the remains of the original mix activates the new one.

I've just read that again & saw he's mixed within a mix, no I use one mix & then make a fresh batch.
I don't clean out my bucket between mixes, the bucket gets scraped with my trowel & a scraper so there's very little left if any in the bucket.
The bucket might get washed at the end of the day or get knocked out the next morning!!

 

[Old Mod]

I've just read that again & saw he's mixed within a mix, no I use one mix & then make a fresh batch.
I don't clean out my bucket between mixes, the bucket gets scraped with my trowel & a scraper so there's very little left if any in the bucket.
The bucket might get washed at the end of the day or get knocked out the next morning!!

:rofl: sorry forgot u don't have time! Hehe

 

[Stef]

:rofl: sorry forgot u don't have time! Hehe

Time is money as they say!!!

I work clean & tidy but not that tidy that I clean my bucket out between mixes!!!

 

[Old Mod]

Time is money as they say!!!

I work clean & tidy but not that tidy that I clean my bucket out between mixes!!!

Just teasing Stef, u know that!

 

[Dougs Third Go]

never top an adhesive with powder or water after initial mix, significantly reduces the bond. I'm sure your tiles that were fixed prior will be fine.

 

[One Day]

There was a time when adhesive would grab so hard onto ply that it would rip the ply to bits trying to take up the tiles. I doubt BAL have reduced the strength of their spf so I would have to wonder how clean and dust-free the ply was to start and how well mixed the adhesive was.
Hand mixing sometimes just doesn't do it well enough.
Personally I wouldn't use spf on wood. The water sits too long before the adhesive sets.

 

[Gazzer]

Plywood isnt what it used to be.

 

[beanz]

Never mess with the mix, once it's done. Your ply should be screwed at 150mm centres. Did you back butter the tiles? If the tiles have only come up on the new mix, I'd just scrape it up and re-lay them. I wouldn't be too surprised if the lot come up before too long though... All you can do now is cross those fingers.

 

[Lee garnham]

Plywood isnt what it used to be.

Woodchip on a hallway floor? Could it be a floating floor? In which case there is more than likely too much movement. I personally wouldnt tile on one without my clients consent regardless of what products are on the market.
Failing that may there have been a bit to much action ontop of the floor soon after tiling. Ie heavy foot traffic or any further works. It takes a good few weeks for adhesive to get a good bite if there has been to much vibration or movement in that time they will just pop up. If neither of them sound likely then grab a bal rep out he could have the adhesive tested for you. I have found bal and there reps great to work with and helpful.

 

[steve187]

what method are you using to put the adhesive on the ply and or the tile

 

[One Day]

Please clarify - is the adhesive sticking to the tiles but not the plywood or is it sticking to the ply but the tiles are lifting away?

 

[Bill]

Adhesive is sticking to the tiles, but not the ply. All the tiles are loose and I've lifted them. Not sure I'm keen to try and re-fix them to the plywood? Any suggestions.....could I maybe fix backerboard on top of the ply?

 

[Bill]

No I didn't back butter the tiles. The rest if the tiles are also loose and I've lifted them. Adhesive is well stuck to the tiles but not stuck to the ply. Any suggestions?

 

[White Room]

Was the mix a tad to dry perhaps....

 

[Bill]

I applied the adhesive to the back of the tiles, not the ply, as I find it easier to work this way?

 

[Bill]

I weighed the adhesive and used the quantity of water on the BAL bag, so I don't think so?

 

[Stef]

I applied the adhesive to the back of the tiles, not the ply, as I find it easier to work this way?

There's your problem.
You need to key in the adhesive to the floor then comb it & also back skim the tile, it gives a far superior bond.

 

[charlie1]

You should plaster the substrate with flat side if trowel the go back over it with notch side, this increases the bond to the substrate significantly

 

[charlie1]

There's your problem.
You need to key in the adhesive to the floor then comb it & also back skim the tile, it gives a far superior bond.

FFs Stef... U read my mind lol

 

[Stef]

FFs Stef... U read my mind lol

I was thinking that when your post popped up!!!