Tiling Job - Need Redoing?

[Herm]

Hi guys and girls

We recently had our shower refitted however have had some problems with cracked grout near the base of the shower. We believe this is because the 'plumber' didn't level the shower tray initially and had to pull it up possibly wrecking the tiling. Unfortunately we didn't notice until after we had paid for the job.

The plumber is offering to regrout (but not remove) the bottom row of tiles but we have had an opinion from a tiler that suggests that the job is lousy and needs to be redone from scratch.

Can anyone suggest whether this is the case from the pictures or offer advice what needs to be done to make this job good.

Would appreciate any advice.

Mixer

• Herm
• May 18, 2016

Mixer 2

• Herm
• May 18, 2016

Loose tile near base

• Herm
• May 18, 2016
• 1

Tiling 1

• Herm
• May 18, 2016

Tiling 2

• Herm
• May 18, 2016

Tiling 3

• Herm
• May 18, 2016

Tiling 4

• Herm
• May 18, 2016

Tiling 5

• Herm
• May 18, 2016

Tiling 6

• Herm
• May 18, 2016

 

[Time's Ran Out]

I assume that the 'plumber' did the tiling.
The Tilers opinion on the standard of tiling seems correct.
Apart from your loose tiles, there are uneven joints, poor grouting and the feature back wall has not been set out from the centre - therefore you have unequal cuts to the corners.
As far as the plumbing side looks, there are no cover plates around the shower inlet pipes, if he levelled the tray after it was tiled he's most likely either not sealed the tray behind the tiles or he's broken the seal.
In general it looks a messy job which is only going to get worse. IMHO I'd strip the lot out and start again - but at what cost!

 

[Old Mod]

Hi and welcome to the forum Herm!
Just to be clear.
So who did all the tiling, your plumber or a tiler?
And you've had an independent tiler view it, who condemned it?
You think that after the tiling was completed, he had to re lift the tray because it wasn't draining properly?
But you're not sure?
Was the shower tanked behind the tiling?
Those cracks certainly appear to be caused by movement.
All the tiles with cracked grout, do they sound hollow if you tap them, or even just sound different to those around them?
Can u feel any movement in the tray, or can you see cracks opening up when you stand in the tray?
The job around the mixer is not very good at all and needs attention cracked tile replacing and sealing, were there no cowls to go around the pipe?
Apart from the tile with cracked grout around mixer, are they all at tray level?
The first 5 images, I can clearly see why they're posted, the final 4?
Viewing on my phone, so images are small and it's not really apparent why you've posted them.
Is it to show the standard in general?

The razors a nice touch.

 

[Herm]

Hello!

Thanks for the replies. My wife and I really appreciate it!

We had the work done 4 months ago. It is our first home together and one of our first projects we have gotten somebody to do so we are not very experienced with dealing with tradesmen. I'm kicking myself because we actually went for a more expensive quote because my wife felt that he was more experienced and knowledgeable.

The tiling was done by the same person who did the 'plumbing', however to call him a plumber would be a bit generous. The plumbing is still leaking but the company is refusing to send somebody to fix it blaming it on our pipework.

The shower was ours left over from the old install - I'm pretty certain the cowboys must have binned the cowls from the shower when they ripped it out. I wish I had taken pictures of the shower before the job for comparison, but you live and you learn.

I very much doubt that the shower was tanked (that's a waterproof membrane right?) - it wasn't listed on the invoice and they appeared to cut corners at every turn. We didn't know that this is something that could potentially be left out so we never requested it specifically.

The cracked grout are all at tray level except those around the mixer. I can't feel any movement around the tray and suspect it was cracked just before Christmas when the 'plumber' lifted the tray to level it, but we didn't notice (or perhaps the cracks have deepened).

The final 4 images were to show the general standard - and that the problems appear to be limited to just around the tray. I had wondered if there was a solution whereby only the lower tiles & mixer could be replaced however it sounds like the job is just so poor quality it's not really viable.

We have arranged to have an experienced bathroom fitter come tomorrow to prepare a report for us on all the problems. so that we can potentially use it as evidence. He is the person who has condemned it when I sent him these same pictures. Do you think I would have any legal recourse to try and get our money back?

 

[Italy]

Also to call tiler. be generous....
sorry but stronger than me

 

[Flintstone]

Looks like there has been a few issues and poor workman ship. Hard to tell what condition it was all in before hand or what budget they were working to, but It's not gonna get any better and will certainly be leaking and soaking the wall within a very short time

 

[peteablard]

is it a private individual that has done it or someone that has been sent by a bathroom company?

 

[Herm]

It is an individual at a small local company. They have since moved on from the company.

However the boss of the company has not been sympathetic to our situation. His (new) professional tiler (who was refreshingly honest with us) has made him aware of the shocking work and the boss has only offered to regrout, which judging by the reactions here will not provide us a permanent resolution to our shower leakage issues.

We have also identified a drainage issue but he has refused to send a plumber out to fix.

Honestly we are feeling that we have been scammed

 

[Herm]

Looks like there has been a few issues and poor workman ship. Hard to tell what condition it was all in before hand or what budget they were working to, but It's not gonna get any better and will certainly be leaking and soaking the wall within a very short time

We paid them to take the old tiles and shower tray out and replace, including the door. The tiling was from scratch so no reason it shouldn't have been done right. The budget was generous compared to our other quotes

 

[WetSaw]

Do you have an invoice from this company or the individual who did the "work"?

 

[Herm]

Do you have an invoice from this company or the individual who did the "work"?

Sure, we have the invoice from the company

 

[One Day]

You definitely have a strong case against the company who invoiced you.
"Reasonable skill and care" and "fit for purpose" are the two legal terms you could research for starters.

Main thing is do everything in writing and give them chance to correct the mess BEFORE you take legal action.

 

[WetSaw]

Then it doesn't matter that the person who did the work is no longer at the company, it is their responsibility to put it right.

 

[Herm]

We paid them to take the old tiles and shower tray out and replace, including the door. The tiling was from scratch so no reason it shouldn't have been done right. The budget was generous compared to our other quotes

You definitely have a strong case against the company who invoiced you.
"Reasonable skill and care" and "fit for purpose" are the two legal terms you could research for starters.

Main thing is do everything in writing and give them chance to correct the mess BEFORE you take legal action.

Thanks. We are so reluctant to have them back in our house again... Other than their new tiler, his attitude to resolving the problems has been awful. We've already been down the route of politely asking for the drainage issue to be fixed, which has been refused blaming it on our existing pipework (it's not)... I am not sure I would ever trust the shower if they came back and fixed it from scratch (though from what I've seen of them they are not likely to do so). Is there any alternative? Can we request our money back, for example? Then we could start all over again.

 

[White Room]

I doubt there would be a hope in hell they would give you your money back by the sound of it...perhaps court maybe an option.

 

[Andy Allen]

Send a recorded letter to them stating all the issues you have and give them 14 days to put them right or you will be taking legal action to recover your losses.
If after 14 days you have no response send another recorded letter stating legal action pending within 7 days.
If no response take them to the small claims court....you can do it all on line for a small cost.

 

[Herm]

Hi all,

Thanks for all the advice. We've had 2 plumbers out to look at the problems and quote for the work necessary to fix. The first was recommended by our boiler engineer, the second we found on trading standard's buywithconfidence website.

The first (he has offered to write us a report) has suggested:

• Taking off the shower door to enable access
• Removing the bottom 2 rows of tiles
• Bringing up the shower tray and sorting out the drainage problem directly under the shower
• Replacing bottom two rows with new tiles and reapplying door, reapplying sealant.

Second plumber agreed that it was a very bad job but he wasn't willing to write us any sort of report we could use, only a quote for what needs doing. He pretty much agreed with the consensus that it needed to be redone He was a bit more thorough and identified the drainage problem that we've been having in a bit more detail. He suggested that we contact trading standards and our insurer and ask them to send somebody out. He was reluctant to discuss a partial solution such as that suggested by the other plumber as he wouldn't be able to guarantee the rest of the work.

I did ask both plumbers about the importance of tanking on this sort of shower and neither seemed to think it was very important.

In contrast the company only ever offered to regrout around the lower tiles, no plumbing work that was necessary.

The only thing concerning me is that these two suggestions are so radically different and I don't know which is the right answer!

 

[Andy Allen]

Why not get tiler round to look at it ?

 

[Herm]

Why not get tiler round to look at it ?

OK - you're right, of course. I'll get in touch with one tomorrow Thanks

 

[Time's Ran Out]

I wouldn't get anyone to fix it yet!
Contact your solicitor and get him to write to the company who messed it up
in the first place. You want your money back, his costs, plus new tiles, walls made good and all rubbish removed from site and any subsequent damage paid for.
Letting them get away with this type of work allows them to continue taking people's hard earned money.
Stand up for your rights and make sure you move forward on the property ladder with a pair of balls!

 

[Herm]

I wouldn't get anyone to fix it yet!
Contact your solicitor and get him to write to the company who messed it up
in the first place. You want your money back, his costs, plus new tiles, walls made good and all rubbish removed from site and any subsequent damage paid for.
Letting them get away with this type of work allows them to continue taking people's hard earned money.
Stand up for your rights and make sure you move forward on the property ladder with a pair of balls!

I'm with you in principle, but worried about the legal fees!

Didn't plan on letting them get away with it but wanted to get someone to assess the extent of the problem and find out how much it would cost to sort out in case it came to it!

 

[Time's Ran Out]

It's a solicitors letter at this stage.
I'll assess it - it's a bridge!
Go for the jugular.

 

[Herm]

It's a solicitors letter at this stage.
I'll assess it - it's a bridge!
Go for the jugular.

OK... We'll look for a solicitor.
You'd be happy writing us the report we need? We can supply more pictures and info. We would be so grateful

 

[Herm]

If we don't find someone to do this written report we don't know how to get the proof that the work isn't good. It's understandable people not wanting to get involved in a legal dispute. It seems like there is very little recourse when the work is not good as everyone wants the work to refit again but nobody wants to support the customer... Any suggestions would be helpful on where to take it from here

Regards

 

[Tile Shop]

To be honest with you, a tilers job is to tile. If you can't find a tiler who can do it for you, your next best step is going to the Furniture Ombudsman. They are the ones who's actual day job it is to do an independent visit and write reports including for wall and floor coverings. Although a tiler could do it for you, bare in mind he would be expecting a day rate for taking the time out to visit and another for writing the report. He would also require paying if he is called in to speak on your behalf if he is required to make a further statement later in the case.

From memory the Ombudsman will charge a flat rate of approx £300-£350 and will be there on hand if ever you need further assistance at a later date, and is much better equipped than a tiler from a law perspective, even if their technical knowledge isn't quite as "on par". But regardless of tile knowledge, he'll visit, look at it and think it looks shocking, write his report, and the solicitor/court will take it as an accurate investigation.