Trading Standards complaints

[faithhealer]

re post http://www.tilersforums.com/new-members-say-hi-here/21425-adhesive-porcelain-tiles-please.html

In Brief, Porcelain tiles fitted with weber fix plus (tub ) Have it in black and white off weber website, DO NOT USE ON PORCELAIN
Trading standards say give contractor 14 days to put right but what do you do if you simply don't want them back because of their incompetance? Contractors want paying in 7 days for work done! I've told 'boro1986 to keep his money
Thoughts lads

 

[Gazzer]

he needs to go to the main contractor or the tiler with the info from Weber and see what is said. Either way the tiler hasnt used the proper adhesive so i would be telling him to get it all redone.

 

[faithhealer]

Thats what I thought Neale. Also told 'craig' to deliver letter in person so he can't be fobbed off

 

[Gazzer]

Better get it recorded/registered delivery as they then have to sign for it. By hand delivering the letter, the contractor could deny ever receiving it.

 

[White Room]

I can see why he dos'nt want them back, I'd be getting all the details of the job just in case this ends up in the small claims court. I would'nt be paying anyone and it could cost the tiler to put it right

 

[Colour Republic]

I can see why he dos'nt want them back, I'd be getting all the details of the job just in case this ends up in the small claims court. I would'nt be paying anyone and it could cost the tiler to put it right

If he witholds payment he would be in breach of contract and the courts could well side with the tiler if he does that... crazy i know but true!

that said... when when was the payment schedule set?

 

[faithhealer]

If he witholds payment he would be in breach of contract and the courts could well side with the tiler if he does that... crazy i know but true!

that said... when when was the payment schedule set?

he recieved his 'bill' for work done after he complained about wrong adhesive I believe

 

[boro1986]

hello there ime the lad with the wrong adhesive problem.thanks for giving me access Dave.i received the letter on tuesday 14/4/09 giving me 7 days to pay an amount ime disputing.ime always willing to pay for work as long as its done to a satisfactory standard which it obviously isnt.to put the job right it will probably end up costing them money and owing me,heres were the problem lies:mad2:

 

[faithhealer]

This was also the floor that was laid and grouted in ONE hour. (and I think, on 6mm ply)

 

[Gazzer]

Let the fixer take on the adhesive manufacturers then. Hasnt got a leg to stand on. Grouted too quick, 6mm not good enough etc etc

 

[Verona]

Hi boro1986,

I feel really sorry for the mess you have been dragged into from a tiler, who should feel ashame of himself and at least putting things right before claiming payment from you.

Just went to read the original thread and must say that I am shocked to hear the several mistakes he has done - and also that he had the tiles cut before starting the job 'as in a rush'!

I'm not a tiler myself but doing the admin for one, but even I know that you dont' grout that soon after using tub addy - as it is chemical it is slow drying! He really shouldn't stand a chance if the case ends in court.

Hopefully you will find a good solution to it and get the work corrected for safety!

Best of luck!
Stina

 

[boro1986]

cheers for all your advice.i dont want to let the company back in house as they have insulted me enough with there work but trading standards have told me to write a letter giving them 14 days to rectify and complete the job which i have done.they have asked me to get 3 seperate quotes for the work they have done,ie taking old bathroom out (which wasnt hard as the toilet was already taken out by myself and bath was out appart from 2 pipes),alter new pipework to suit(basically moving it below floor boards but not rearranging as everything was staying in same place),fitting shower tray and preparing floor for tiling.ps/they have even used something like 6mm plywood which you have told me is incorrect thickness.
Trading standards have asked me to get 3 seperate quotes to take tiles off walls and floor,clean them and walls/or buy new tiles and obviously fit correctly.whilst all this has being going on ive had no option but to ask a friend to fit my shower,bath.sink,toilet etc as we cannot live without it as you can imagine.ive had to pay mate for this.i find it ridiculous that i hae to ask them back and also give them 14 days to rectify and complete the work.how can you do without a bathroom for so long.think ile see a soliciter as this has caused lots of unwanted stress which i dont need at all.thanks to john and dave for all your help

 

[lawrenso]

Hi Boro,

I fully sympathise with you on this - I am going through the same as you. There is also the case of reasonableness. It is unreasonable to expect you to do without a bathroom for a period of time. I would get the work done at your earliest convenience. Take photographs of everything - if possible find a TTA tiler in your area to do a report- this will give you more weight to anything. Also, get a statement from your adhesive manufacturer as regards to suitability - they usually have area reps that will call in as I have found out.

To be honest - you could more than likely remove the wall tiles and be a able to scrape the tubbed addy off the majority and soak the rest of and rub it down. Unfortunately without a working bath you will have a hard job to find something large enough to take the tiles and it will take a long time in itself if it is a large number of tiles. But they should come off without damaging the surface, although from the sounds of it you need to come up with a solution to the weight issue on the walls.

In my situation, the walls were kaput after removing - he had used powdered but had dot and dabbed a large amount of them and the quality of finish all round was terrible. I am just waiting for a price to replace the door (yes - he hacked the door to try and get it to fit after his tiling :yikes and I will be submitting my claim via www.moneyclaim.gov.uk

Ours has an extra little twist though - the tiler is threatening to do me for harassment because of posts on here :yikes:- Dan (the owner) and Dave are aware of this. Have a look down the tilers arms forum and you will see my two threads relating to my issue.

You have come to the right place for advice - cracking bunch of guys and gals on here (cue Jimmy Saville impersonation :smilewinkgrin

Good luck with it all mate and don't let them get you down.

Steve

 

[boro1986]

thanks for advice.i feel for you also as yours now sounds worse,heres m,e thinking it couldnt get worse.ile have a look on your threads later on when i have time.good luck
regards
craig

 

[lawrenso]

I would say mine is more messy but yours could of been equally as dangerous as your tiles could of come off the wall with what they have used. This is what has got me fully fuelled on this - the guy put my kids lives at risk due to his incompetence.

Good luck

Steve

 

[boro1986]

judging by all the help and advice ive had i dont think the company have a leg to stand on.i would like to just get on with getting my bathroom fitted and if it ends up costing me more for there bad work ile claim it back from them but trading standards have told me i must give them the chance to rectify and complete the work.i dont want them back in my house but dont want to lose the case.your right in what your saying about the concern of injury and that must go for us both in a claims court
regards
craig

 

[lawrenso]

judging by all the help and advice ive had i dont think the company have a leg to stand on.i would like to just get on with getting my bathroom fitted and if it ends up costing me more for there bad work ile claim it back from them but trading standards have told me i must give them the chance to rectify and complete the work.i dont want them back in my house but dont want to lose the case.your right in what your saying about the concern of injury and that must go for us both in a claims court
regards
craig

All our tiler said (or rather his dad) said was they would inject stuff in the visible spaces behind tiles!! Were not prepared to do anything else - two letters with no response.

Given him all the chances he needs

To be honest - I think 7 days would be long enough - what was the scheduled finish date?

Steve

 

[faithhealer]

All our tiler said (or rather his dad) said was they would inject stuff in the visible spaces behind tiles!! Were not prepared to do anything else - two letters with no response.

Given him all the chances he needs

To be honest - I think 7 days would be long enough - what was the scheduled finish date?

Steve

The schedule for Craigs work was
start 30th mar Finish 3rd april, but nowhere near finished on that day.(this was when craig suspected tiling was incorrect) Craig paid someone else to fit the bathroom as , obviously a family needs a bathroom!
the builders then said they would return on thurs 9th but said on wednesday 8th that they would not be returning but wanted payment for work done!
think I've got that right craig

 

[boro1986]

yes john appart from i didnt get anyone in to start fitting my complete sanitary ware till monday(13/4/09).
still not finished as wots point as tiles have to come off.we still dont have it complete as trading standards say have to ask them to complete work within 14 days.surely this cant be right ! there must be something called " customer rights"

 

[Daveyboy]

Hi Craig..I'm a trading standards approved business and yes it is true that you have to give the company the opportunity to rectify their mistakes. If they refuse, then you can get someone else in to put it right and deduct the costs from their payment. You may also be able to bill them for additional expenditure but I would take legal advice before taking that step. You can fit the sanitaryware temporarily and I would include this in the letter or a follow-up letter, so that they are aware they will have to remove the products before they can rectify their mistakes.

Also, I assume they gave you an estimate or quote for the works together with the scheduled start/finish dates. That document should also have specified the payment terms and if it says 'on completion of works' then you do not legally have to pay them anything until the works are completed.

Also, a little unknown law.. since 1 Oct 08, all estimate/quotes/contracts over £35 that are concluded during the visit, must have a cooling off period of at least seven days and must include details of the consumer's right to cancel the contract. It does not usually apply to contracts concluded after the trader has left the premises but your trading standards staff may be able to advise whether your contract should have had it included, if it was given to you after they had left your premises.

Good luck!

 

[lawrenso]

Hi Craig..I'm a trading standards approved business and yes it is true that you have to give the company the opportunity to rectify their mistakes. If they refuse, then you can get someone else in to put it right and deduct the costs from their payment. You may also be able to bill them for additional expenditure but I would take legal advice before taking that step. You can fit the sanitaryware temporarily and I would include this in the letter or a follow-up letter, so that they are aware they will have to remove the products before they can rectify their mistakes.

Also, I assume they gave you an estimate or quote for the works together with the scheduled start/finish dates. That document should also have specified the payment terms and if it says 'on completion of works' then you do not legally have to pay them anything until the works are completed.

Also, a little unknown law.. since 1 Oct 08, all estimate/quotes/contracts over £35 that are concluded during the visit, must have a cooling off period of at least seven days and must include details of the consumer's right to cancel the contract. It does not usually apply to contracts concluded after the trader has left the premises but your trading standards staff may be able to advise whether your contract should have had it included, if it was given to you after they had left your premises.

Good luck!

Hi Daveyboy - any advice you can through on my thread would be greatly appreciated. i.e. Paid Tiler 350 out of 500 but has cost 1600 to get it all rectified.

Cheers

Steve

 

[Olz]

cheers for all your advice.i dont want to let the company back in house as they have insulted me enough with there work but trading standards have told me to write a letter giving them 14 days to rectify and complete the job which i have done.they have asked me to get 3 seperate quotes for the work they have done,ie taking old bathroom out (which wasnt hard as the toilet was already taken out by myself and bath was out appart from 2 pipes),alter new pipework to suit(basically moving it below floor boards but not rearranging as everything was staying in same place),fitting shower tray and preparing floor for tiling.ps/they have even used something like 6mm plywood which you have told me is incorrect thickness.
Trading standards have asked me to get 3 seperate quotes to take tiles off walls and floor,clean them and walls/or buy new tiles and obviously fit correctly.whilst all this has being going on ive had no option but to ask a friend to fit my shower,bath.sink,toilet etc as we cannot live without it as you can imagine.ive had to pay mate for this.i find it ridiculous that i hae to ask them back and also give them 14 days to rectify and complete the work.how can you do without a bathroom for so long.think ile see a soliciter as this has caused lots of unwanted stress which i dont need at all.thanks to john and dave for all your help

As frustrating as it is, you need to do exactly what trading standards tell you to do, if you dont, eg only give them 7 days not the advised 14 you will just be giving them get out's and may end up losing the case.

 

[boro1986]

hi Dave.there is nothing on the quotation regarding what you say.all thats on the contract is total jobs,total price,start and estimated finish date.1 piece of paper
regards
craig

 

[Daveyboy]

hi Dave.there is nothing on the quotation regarding what you say.all thats on the contract is total jobs,total price,start and estimated finish date.1 piece of paper
regards
craig

Hmmm.. ok, as you're calling it a quotation, I'm assuming that word appears on the document so that means it is a fixed price for the works listed; any other works not listed on the document would be viewed as an additional work and the cost agreed with you prior to it being carried out. An estimated finish date means the works could take longer than planned but within reason; if they allowed 5 days and it takes more than 10 days, I reckon that would be considered unreasonable, unless major unforeseen works was necessary. As there are no specified payments terms on the document and if there has been no verbal discussion about payments prior to works commencing, it is reasonable for you to assume payment will be on completion of works and not before. They would also have to submit an invoice for the works.

 

[mikethetile]

unless previously agreed payment is on satisfactory completion of job

if i understand the situation right they are demanding payment for works done so far and have indicated they will not return

proceed with caution at this stage as the law is a minefield

im assuming that you supplied the tiles and they specified and supplied the adhesive

write back and state you are n ot satisfied with the works giving your reason ie incorrect and unsuitable adhesive used

state in the letter you are not refusing to pay and would like the tiles replaced at their expence and stuck with the correct adhesive, giving them 14 days to either reccomence work or book it in asap

also state that as they have left your family without amenities you have incurred extra expense to have your pan etc temporarily refitted and you will be stopping this from their invoice

this should cover you on refusing to settle their invoice and puts the ball back in their court

remember you will pay...................as soon as they have completed the job they quoted for