Vote Leave Or Vote Remain?

[rufus the tiler]

For me the leave campaign is focusing on people's fear of immigration and refugees (two completely different things but spun as the same by a right wing media). I cannot stand Cameron and it's going to kill me to vote on a subject the same way as him, but we're not voting for people here we're voting for an ideal. I'm in Liverpool, without EU money we'd have been "managed to decline" to paraphrase Maggie. We're thriving in comparison to 20 years ago. My wife is a doctor at Alderhey, she's largely funded by EU money. The new hospital was built with EU money as is the new centre of research for childhood diseases. The new Mersey crossing majority funded by EU. Manchester after the IRA bombings rebuilt with EU money (2.5billion compared to pennies from our own government). People say the money saved by leaving will save the NHS. Bo!!ocks. Boris has previously campaigned to privatise, Michael Gove wanted it paid by insurance like the wholly unfair American system and Iain Duncan Smith cut, cut and cut again money to the country's poorest, it used to be called welfare now it's benefits. When you look at the people and organisations that are in favour of remain and compare that to those who favour leave I find it truly terrifying. Trump, Farage, BNP, EDL, Boris, Murdoch, everyone of them right wing power crazed lunatics. Whole campaign for me is based on racist xenophobia.

money money money money......GREAT BRITAIN NEEDS SAVING......,.fear of immigrants is a big enough excuse to leave by itself for many reasons.......when thickos call me a racist(which i aint) i give the example of crimewatchs top 10 most wanted from 20 years ago and the the top 10 nowadays.....its a bbc programme and we all know how left wing they are.......its majority foreign names nowadays.....Priorities people ...we need to VOTE OUT.

 

[Rich Midge]

money money money money......GREAT BRITAIN NEEDS SAVING......,.fear of immigrants is a big enough excuse to leave by itself for many reasons.......when thickos call me a racist(which i aint) i give the example of crimewatchs top 10 most wanted from 20 years ago and the the top 10 nowadays.....its a bbc programme and we all know how left wing they are.......its majority foreign names nowadays.....Priorities people ...we need to VOTE OUT.

Why such a fear of immigrants? The NHS would have collapsed years ago without it's migrant workers. My in laws are Irish immigrants and faced the same prejudices when they first moved "no blacks, no Irish". I've family members, tilers, who worked in Germany and Holland when times were bad here because they had too and because they could. I myself have worked in France, not because i particularly wanted too but because it was the best option for myself and my family at the time, possible because of EU membership. Also what's a foreign name? If you're not a Smith you're a foreigner?

 

[J Sid]

it's not fear of immigration, it's fear of UNCONTROLLED immigration. Yes we do need immigrates, but we need to control who we let in to keep, yes NHS amount other, working.
We have NO control as it stands now.

 

[Rich Midge]

We have as much control as any other EU country and take in less than some and more than others. I think this is where some people get confused with immigrants and refugees. Refugees are simply that. People in need of refuge often from war torn countries outside of the EU. Would I pick my kids up and flee in their situation, yes without question. I wholeheartedly agree we need more control but I think that can be achieved through EU membership, immigration is seemingly an issue in many European countries. As regards the BBC, isn't it funny that those of us with left leanings see them as a right leaning institute and the right see them as left. The Beeb's reporting of the junior doctors dispute for example was completely inaccurate and just followed the government line.

 

[Ajax123]

so is the referendum all about immigration then??? I thought there was a lot more to it. Net migration into the UK is actually not a big deal in terms of the cost. I think there are surely far bigger things to debate and far bigger issues that have been caused by incompetent government and poor cost control and abysmal central management such as the NHS, local and national ecology, the housing crisis etc. thee are British problems, not european ones. Where I live without the immigrant population you would have not food on the table, no one to wash our car, no one to clean your streets etc cos the bloody lazy arsed xenophobic bigoted brits dont want to do those jobs. They would rather sit on their backsides smoking weed and filming britain on benefits. For crying out loud, get a grip.

 

[J Sid]

this vote is about only one thing.....

control

as a British citizen we want the power to vote into government a party that can make decisions on everything from imagination to fisheries to financial matter's.

if you want control, vote out
if you are happy to keep giving control away to the EU, then vote in

 

[Rich Midge]

so is the referendum all about immigration then??? I thought there was a lot more to it. Net migration into the UK is actually not a big deal in terms of the cost. I think there are surely far bigger things to debate and far bigger issues that have been caused by incompetent government and poor cost control and abysmal central management such as the NHS, local and national ecology, the housing crisis etc. thee are British problems, not european ones. Where I live without the immigrant population you would have not food on the table, no one to wash our car, no one to clean your streets etc cos the bloody lazy arsed xenophobic bigoted brits dont want to do those jobs. They would rather sit on their backsides smoking weed and filming britain on benefits. For crying out loud, get a grip.

EXACTLY!
Every debate I enter into whether it's other social media or anywhere else, the overriding argument to leave is based on xenophobia. This is the first forum where someone has put forward a financial argument. Without wishing to sound like a hippy what makes Britain great is its inclusiveness not it's divisiveness. I'll happily listen to arguments from both sides but the rhetoric from the leave campaign is always the same old blame the immigrants.

 

[Dan]

We put more into the EU than we get out and both sides of the argument have agreed that.

The remain campaign say it's worth it though because we have better allies and protection and get to share Intel etc

They skip past the fact we get paid by the US to share Intel. So perhaps not really worth paying EU for some too.

 

[Rich Midge]

Farage had sorting the fisheries as a manifesto promise. He attended 1 of 42 scheduled meetings as an MEP regarding fisheries. That Hugh Wittingstal fella off the TV led a campaign to stop senseless waste of fish and succeeded. Wouldn't trust Nigel, simply power hungry and out for himself.

this vote is about only one thing.....

control

as a British citizen we want the power to vote into government a party that can make decisions on everything from imagination to fisheries to financial matter's.

if you want control, vote out
if you are happy to keep giving control away to the EU, then vote in

 

[Dan]

EXACTLY!
Every debate I enter into whether it's other social media or anywhere else, the overriding argument to leave is based on xenophobia. This is the first forum where someone has put forward a financial argument. Without wishing to sound like a hippy what makes Britain great is its inclusiveness not it's divisiveness. I'll happily listen to arguments from both sides but the rhetoric from the leave campaign is always the same old blame the immigrants.

I certainly aren't voting over immigration, or for financial reasons, although as a small business I want my money to stay closer to home. That's fair to say.

I'm voting to gain back our powers. Of which dishing out to EU when we're such a strong country is ludicrous IMO.

 

[J Sid]

think you need to widen your horizons I bit with regards to what you listen to and read.
I hear and read arguments for imagination, monetary, policies (fisheries, farming etc.) and business everyday.

 

[Rich Midge]

We all hear and read the arguments, it comes down to which you believe. I don't for one second believe the nonsense Osborne spouted this week for example. I actually think it may be of detriment to the remain campaign as it was obviously scaremongering and bull#!£t. I do actually think that eventually in who knows how long we'd be alright if we came out, I just believe fully we're better off in.

 

[J Sid]

Farage had sorting the fisheries as a manifesto promise. He attended 1 of 42 scheduled meetings as an MEP regarding fisheries. That Hugh Wittingstal fella off the TV led a campaign to stop senseless waste of fish and succeeded. Wouldn't trust Nigel, simply power hungry and out for himself.

what's Farage got to do with it? His one person out of many millions who want out!
instead of pointing out what you perceive as negatives of the out campaign you could convince use of why we should stay in, besides more money for your city and nhs nurse's.

 

[Dan]

View: https://www.facebook.com/RTUKnews/videos/1578332669123277/


Watch his videos he's really funny.

 

[Rich Midge]

Well that pretty much sums it up Dan

Argument for staying in comes from i firmly believe Britain has and does benefit from being a part of the EU. It's no way perfect and I don't think anyone is foolish enough to argue otherwise. My missus is currently on paid maternity leave, an EU law, holiday pay and amount of days you get, EU law, but yes my main reason does come down to my city and my family. Liverpool criminally ignored and underfunded and ridiculed by successive governments stands strong in the World because of the EU. Yes I'm aware that as a country we've sent money their way first to benefit a greater good. A Tory government or a UKIP etc out of the EU wouldn't invest in this city. We're the third most visited city in Britain, have an economy on balance that is growing and it's been done without government support. Also with regards the NHS, a vote leave opens up the probable signing of TTIP which will basically destroy what we know as our NHS.