Bodged up jobs ...

[ian158]

yes £2 million...Mate i've seen no end of builders and plumbers do awful jobs..some silly little things...even had a plumber install a gas range cooker who charges £350 a day and had to tell him I wasn't happy with his gas connection and told him to position it so I could at least push the range in the gap so as not to put pressure on the gas pipe and the range dont stick out past the units, he didn't like it but £80 for 30 minutes work I want it right !

 

[Pernah]

Following up from my post on bodged up shower room...

I chose my tiler on Tile Shop owners recommendation - he was more expensive than 2 other quotes so I thought I'd get a better job - how wrong I was as found him doing d'n'd, he also forgot to fit tile to vinyl capping strip and stopped tiling when he came to the beginning of bathroom units instead of cutting a tile to shape round it to take tiling to end of wall which I asked him to do.

TBH I never knew until I came on this sight tilers could be qualified, but then again its just a 2 to 6 week course. Experience makes difference and its whether you know the art of tiling and how to use your tools,

I also suppose it come down to no-one knowing how much a pro tiler would charge compared to a cowboy and how do you identify a pro tiler? Qualifications don't make difference as its just a quick course, anyone can say they've got so many years experience and show pic's on website of someone elses job and TBH no-ones got the time to go to a previous job done 10 miles away before thinking of saying yes.

Do you guys have to pay TTA? If so get them to promote TTA by advertising with someone like Screwfix who are nationwide and would promote members/pro's through their website. Do TTA advertise i yellow pages/thomson local? Trading Standards could promote TTA registered tilers and if more and more customers went to TTA to choose their tielrs then more and more tilers would want to become members to get the work maybe?

 

[DHTiling]

Can I ask .... Why do you think it takes 2 to 6 weeks to train as a tiler. ?

An apprenticeship takes min 4 yrs like any other pro trade does.

See now if this is how the public portray tiling as a trade , then it is worrying

 

[andy8758]

Take a gander at the electricians forum if you want to see some more concerns about tradesmen cashing in on "anyone can do this" training. It does not start and stop with tiling. Bodged plastering is more and more obvious. Carpenters who cant cut wood straight. Bricklayers who cant fix a course of brickwork straight and level. Plumbers who can only push fit pipe connections..... The TTA needs to revise its role. Take a leaf out of the NICEIC handbook and start getting proactive - get involved with the makers of programmes like DIY SOS - give Dom Littlewood honorary membership of the TTA - look for dis-satisfied customers and get them publicity of their bodged tiling work in local media perhaps even helping them sue the offending tiler. And that's just a start. Its easy to criticise poor workmanship but a lot harder to do something to stop it happening again. I know you senior tilers are not policemen - but maybe you need to lobby the TTA to become something more than a just a Trade Body even if it means the TTA employing the policemen for you. There is a lot of pride on this forum (much of it fully justified) but the customers out there need to be educated by somebody and it could perhaps be you.

 

[The D]

Following up from my post on bodged up shower room...

I chose my tiler on Tile Shop owners recommendation - he was more expensive than 2 other quotes so I thought I'd get a better job - how wrong I was as found him doing d'n'd, he also forgot to fit tile to vinyl capping strip and stopped tiling when he came to the beginning of bathroom units instead of cutting a tile to shape round it to take tiling to end of wall which I asked him to do.

TBH I never knew until I came on this sight tilers could be qualified, but then again its just a 2 to 6 week course. Experience makes difference and its whether you know the art of tiling and how to use your tools,

I also suppose it come down to no-one knowing how much a pro tiler would charge compared to a cowboy and how do you identify a pro tiler? Qualifications don't make difference as its just a quick course, anyone can say they've got so many years experience and show pic's on website of someone elses job and TBH no-ones got the time to go to a previous job done 10 miles away before thinking of saying yes.

Do you guys have to pay TTA? If so get them to promote TTA by advertising with someone like Screwfix who are nationwide and would promote members/pro's through their website. Do TTA advertise i yellow pages/thomson local? Trading Standards could promote TTA registered tilers and if more and more customers went to TTA to choose their tielrs then more and more tilers would want to become members to get the work maybe?

This is exactly why I get the raving hump with training centres advertising there short practical courses as a full qualifications THEY ARE NOT in any way shape or form a full tiling qualification. No mater how you dress it up or word it a 1,2,3,4,5,6 week training course is nothing more than TRAINING it does not make you qualified. The only industry recognised qualification at the moment for a tiler is the NVQ 1,2,3 or 4

It does not matter if the sort course fast track in house certificate has had the approval of City & Guilds or the Construction Awards Alliance or the Learning Skills Council or The Tile Association if it is not an NVQ it is just a training certificate. IMHO

 

[Stef]

Do a 2 week tiling course & make £40k a year!!
That's the usual adverts.

I'm not a qualified tiler but I know through seeing other tilers work round here that I'm one of the best tilers in my area.

I still hear tilers talking PVA???

I still hear I've done it this way for 20 odd years & never had a problem & this is coming from time served tilers..

Tiling is an art form & till joe public realise its a real trade & not "oh everyone can tile" then we will keep hearing more & more about bad workmanship..

 

[ian158]

I remember when I passed my driving test....my instructor said...now my friend the learning begins !

 

[ian158]

By the way whats does being a member of the TTA mean...I remember loads of builders joining the Guild of master craftsman...the swarm of dodgy builders joining that was a joke !

 

[Peter]

Took me four years before my boss allowed me to call myself a tiler. Don't know how training centres think you can learn four years worth in six weeks. When you think about it, you spend more hours serving your time at a trade than you do studying for a bachelor's degree.

 

[White Room]

By the way whats does being a member of the TTA mean...I remember loads of builders joining the Guild of master craftsman...the swarm of dodgy builders joining that was a joke !

You pay your money and they give you a badge to confuse the consumer....it means diddly.

 

[edthetiler]

Hi all ive just signed up and read this thread i also find this frustrating!
Just last week i was called to look at a job and give a price by a member of a previous customers family. I gave them a quote for supply and fit for 20m2 of ceramic wall tiles including materials with a REDUCED labour rate as a favour AND trade price on tiles/materials. ( I did her brothers whole house).
She got another quote of a builder/ handyman and his quote came in at just over HALF my price. She told me and i explained her tiles and materials were almost as much as his whole quote, it is impossible to get a half decent job with the correct materials ANYWHERE NEAR that price. Her brother rang her and told her the same thing ( Hes a builder who knows the score, he paid ME to do his!)

Who do you think she chose?

It wasnt me!

 

[gamma38]

Governing bodies are not the be all and end all imo. Sometimes all your doing is paying money to put a badge or sticker on your van or website. It does not make anyone a tradesman and it never will, or can i don't think. The only way a governing body could have a reasonable effect it would have to go down the route of certification like gas safe or nic/eic. I'm not sure that would or could happen with tiling. Like some have said these people have been around forever, it is easier these day's to get your bodged job out there with forums like this or facebook, there is any number of way's. Extreme cases have dominic little arse running down a street after someone. Something has to be done but it's not only the tilers, it's also the public that has to change, check references properly, listen to tradesmen, just because they talk about prep work and products doesn't mean they are trying to rip you off or big up the job. And definetly don't always go for the cheapest qoute.

 

[The Legend; Phil Hobson RIP]

I must say, where anyone gets the idea that a real tiler is produced from a short course? it's no wonder people are getting ripped off by cowboys and chancers. Customers need to do some research, there are still some real good tradesmen out there, you need to find them. This forum is a good source of info on tilers you can read the posts and sort the wheat from the chaff. Tiling is, was, and always be a very skilled trade. Rant over.:mad2:

 

[The Legend; Phil Hobson RIP]

Sorry Gamma, post overlap I think we are saying the same thing though.

 

[gamma38]

Sorry Gamma, post overlap I think we are saying the same thing though.

Definetly

 

[Spud]

It is how the public see tradesmen in general which is lamentable to be honest , joe public will happily pay £60 per hour to have their car repaired or pay £40 an hour for a personal trainer , but think they can employ by some miracle an experienced proficient tradesman for next to nothing

 

[High Peak Tiling]

Lets face it " anyone can tile" !!!! :mad2:

I am all with Neale here.

I also think if we the 'real' tradesmen all mainly joined the TTA (if feasible) and the Association was able to inspect us I would be up for that!

 

[The Legend; Phil Hobson RIP]

Amen to that Gary, time for some common sense imho.

 

[Spud]

best thing to do is just make sure you have as much detail in you quotes as possible, do a scope of works outlining what you will be doing which materials you will be using and when you are free to do the work
Place in large capitals at the bottom of the page you will match any genuine like for like quote printed on headed paper, this may actually get the customer to properly read the other quotes rather than looking at the bottom line where the price is

 

[Sean SML Tiling]

I thought the TTA inspected your work before they let you join?

 

[High Peak Tiling]

best thing to do is just make sure you have as much detail in you quotes as possible, do a scope of works outlining what you will be doing which materials you will be using and when you are free to do the work
Place in large capitals at the bottom of the page you will match any genuine like for like quote printed on headed paper, this may actually get the customer to properly read the other quotes rather than looking at the bottom line where the price is

I always explain briefly the outline of what needs to be done roughly & WHY!
what gears is needed & WHY!

i have found simple hints of knowledge settles or gives the customer confidence in you & your quote, now they know whats going where & roughly why.

Do you carry header & footed printed out copies with you Gary? then just write on it?

I only carry a duplicate carbon paper book and write in that, keeping the copy.

 

[Pernah]

Who do you think she chose?

It wasnt me![/QUOTE]
And what was the outcome of the job? Was she happy with quality? DId handyman do good job? Would she choose him again when she knows what your work is like having done her brothers house?

 

[Spud]

I always explain briefly the outline of what needs to be done roughly & WHY!
what gears is needed & WHY!

i have found simple hints of knowledge settles or gives the customer confidence in you & your quote, now they know whats going where & roughly why.

Do you carry header & footed printed out copies with you Gary? then just write on it?

I only carry a duplicate carbon paper book and write in that, keeping the copy.

I always try to do mine via e-mail

 

[High Peak Tiling]

cheers mate