customer complaint

[DHTiling]

WOW..some strong opinions there....!!!


Miss tiler....Have anice chat to your customer and ask how they feel it will best be resolved...not the word from the builder..imo...

Also the customer got the builder to tell me of his moans rather than calling me himself

The builder might just be making it sound worse than it is.....

Try and be calm when chatting to the customer and see whats what tomorrow.....good luck and please let us know how you get on...

 

[Mrs Tiler]

Daveyboy, thanks for you post. This is very helpful advice and I think for what he paid the finish is reasonable and I will point that out to him when I can speak to him. I tried today but no luck. If I cant get to speak to him tomorrow then I guess I will have to email.

 

[Sean Kelly]

Mrs Tiler it's easy for someone to point out flaws in someone elses work, but only you really know what the substrate is like under the tile. Did the customer or builder stand on the tile before it had time to set? Did you lay the tile knowing that it had a slight lip or was slightly out? Being a tiler you will spot many flaws in your work (I do). Has any tiler ever produced the perfect flawless tiling job? Unfortunately some people do want perfection and will try and get the work done for virtually nothing or even free. You really need to speak to the customer and find out exactly what they think is wrong with the tiling job. Then ask them what they want you to do about rectifing the situation. It could be a discount or it could be replace/re align the tiles. If you can cover the cost of your materials then you have lost nothing, but have learned something. Your original post does not give us a lot of information i.e. is your contract with the builder or the customer? who is paying you......the builder or the customer? Personally I would only speak to the person paying my wage. It does sound like you are upset with this episode and your pride has been bruised. If you feel that the work you have done is to a good enough standard for the price you are charging then you should stand your ground. However, going to court will be a very painful experience. Good luck Sean

 

[Mrs Tiler]

Putting aside emotions and what you/we ourselves consider acceptable and would/would not do, taking a dispute to court should be the absolute last resort.. a Judge will not entertain an application where there has been no attempt to reach an agreement between the two parties..where there is documented evidence that attempts to reach an agreement have been made but have been unsuccessful, a Judge will consider whether the disputed work is considered reasonable or unreasonable for the monetary amount being claimed and will require independent documented supporting evidence.. i.e. if you pay someone £5 m2 it is unreasonable to expect a high quality finish, if you pay someone £50 m2 it is reasonable to expect a high quality finish..

Reputation is very important...businesses of all sizes can go under if their reputation is ruined - remember Ratner Jewellers? - so you have to ask yourself 'do I have a strong case and if I do not resolve this amicably, 'is my business going to suffer in the short, mid and long term?' Equally, you do not want a reputation of being a pushover, so it's a fine line to walk..

Consumers have rights..if a client is unhappy with the quality/standard of workmanship, they have a right to ask for the work to be rectified within reason i.e. in line with what they are paying for the work. They cannot get someone in to rectify your work without first giving you written notice that they are unhappy with your work and want you to rectify it within an agreed timeframe..

Tradesmen have rights..if you cannot reach an amicable agreement with the client, you have the right to take the matter to court and/or to undo/remove the work and cancel the invoice, but you will have to consider costs, chances of success (in court) and how this might impact on your reputation and future business.

My advice is that you need to talk to your client about their complaints as a matter of urgency before the situation gets out of control...good luck

Mrs Tiler it's easy for someone to point out flaws in someone elses work, but only you really know what the substrate is like under the tile. Did the customer or builder stand on the tile before it had time to set? Did you lay the tile knowing that it had a slight lip or was slightly out? Being a tiler you will spot many flaws in your work (I do). Has any tiler ever produced the perfect flawless tiling job? Unfortunately some people do want perfection and will try and get the work done for virtually nothing or even free. You really need to speak to the customer and find out exactly what they think is wrong with the tiling job. Then ask them what they want you to do about rectifing the situation. It could be a discount or it could be replace/re align the tiles. If you can cover the cost of your materials then you have lost nothing, but have learned something. Your original post does not give us a lot of information i.e. is your contract with the builder or the customer? who is paying you......the builder or the customer? Personally I would only speak to the person paying my wage. It does sound like you are upset with this episode and your pride has been bruised. If you feel that the work you have done is to a good enough standard for the price you are charging then you should stand your ground. However, going to court will be a very painful experience. Good luck Sean

Hi Sean, I think the work is good enough for what for what I have charged. The substrate is fine as its a new build and I personally laid marmox board down first. I used the best materials and the floor is never going to fail, its just not quite perfect but its good for what he paid. The customer should not have involved the builder and that was a tactic to put extra pressure on me and on the builder, I have tried to speak to the customer today but he has not returned my calls. As for court - I'M not phased by that and i do have public Liability insurance.However, these people arent fools, they are university lecturers so they will know how to structure an argument - but so do I

 

[Thespanishtiler]

quote sean kelly

"If you feel that the work you have done is to a good enough standard for the price you are charging then you should stand your ground."

when did the tile fixing industry introduce a quality to cost sliding scale that is acceptable to work to ?

if its wrong its wrong

 

[diamondtiling]

What has Public liability got to do with anything mrs T? I have apolicy for 5 mil but that would not pay out if i was in a situation similar to yours, You have not done anything where you can claim on your Insurance, that is there in case of you causing damage to property or people in the course of your work. No solicitor will ever advise you to go to court because you will lose, You seem to have asked for advice and then because it is not what you want to hear or read you refuse to acknowledge you have made a mistake, I hate decorating and I get someone in, the last bill was £1800 a few years ago, all carried out to a brilliant standard but if I had found something that I was not happy with then I would have said so and I know that the guy would fix it, He is a friend but I still wouldn't let him have my hard earned money until I was happy.
I dont think we are going to be able to help you anymore as you seem to have made your mind up.
:dizzy2:

 

[doug boardley]

Please Mrs Tiler, don't take this the wrong way..... there has been plenty of jobs over the years where I think that I haven't been paid what the job was worth, but I would always do my damnest to make the finish look faultless, not always possible granted. But if a customer pulled me up on a job that I'd done and been paid for, and I could see that they had a valid point, I'd try and rectify it at my own expense regardless of wether I'd been paid enough or not. I think of it as professional and personal pride.
As I said at the start, it's not a dig at you, just a statement of what I'd do

 

[Sean Kelly]

quote sean kelly

If you feel that the work you have done is to a good enough standard for the price you are charging then you should stand your ground.

when did the tile fixing industry introduce a quality to cost sliding scale that is acceptable to work to ?

if its wrong its wrong

What I am saying is that some customers demand a 'mirror finish' and are willing to pay a tiler more money for a near perfect job. I've seen at least one post on this forum where a customer has stated to the tiler at the quote stage that he/she wanted a flat tiled floor. This of course is achievable, but comes at a cost because it takes longer to achieve. I do not know what was discussed between Mrs T and the customer at the quote stage. So, there you have an example of a quality to cost sliding scale. Cheers Sean

 

[Spud]

What I am saying is that some customers demand a 'mirror finish' and are willing to pay a tiler more money for a near perfect job. I've seen at least one post on this forum where a customer has stated to the tiler at the quote stage that he/she wanted a flat tiled floor. This of course is achievable, but comes at a cost because it takes longer to achieve. I do not know what was discussed between Mrs T and the customer at the quote stage. So, there you have an example of a quality to cost sliding scale. Cheers Sean

sean, bit of friendly advice ,if you want to build a reputation you wont compromise on quality whatever the price and if you cant get the money you need to do quality work, walk away and let someone else do it

 

[Thespanishtiler]

sean not getting at you mate.

we are on the whole self emplyed here on the forum and as such the buck stops with us. no one can insist that we do anything less than work and charge according to the standards we have chosen for ourselves.

Gary the tiler puts it better than me, and i would imagine that like me he has an excellant reputation that he would do everything to safeguard.

sorry if i got your back up but please dont rush to defend sub standard work.

 

[Gazzer]

Ok, an interesting thread.
From the photo i have seen i would not be happy with this tiling.
Its a fairly small area unless the photo doesnt show the whole story.
Taking up the tiles complained about may not rectify the job.
If you were not happy with the substrate you should have said so.
If you really want to take it to court as you say you are not phased by it you wil lose more in the long run.
You will lose,
Time in court
You will lose the case, you are suppossed to be a professional and yet you admit the floor has lips and joints out of line.
You stand to lose a reputation.
You will lose more money than you would if you just wrote it off.
.......
Your choice....Lose or Lose ..

Lets put it this way..
If a tiler from this forum was to act as an independent witness to the quality of that floor (regardless of how much they paid) what do you think they would say ?

 

[Sean Kelly]

Gary & TheSpanishTiler, I can sometimes work on one tile for half an hour to get it cut right because I tile to how I would wish my own house tiled. I walked away from a job last month as the customer wanted 500x500 polished porcelain tiles (the ones with sharp edges) tiled onto a really rough kitchen floor. The customer stated that I should be able to pack it out with addy to get a perfect finish. Anyway, I knew I could not produce a good enough finish so I had to explain that I was not the man for the job. I am defending MrsT because we only have her side of the story. For all we know the job she did could be really good and she should be paid for it. We do not have the other side of the story. The written word can be misinterpreted and my previous posts might not exactly appear the way I wanted them to appear. Maybe it’s because I’m feeling knackered from work and a bit tipsy from 2 glasses of wine! Anyway, I agree with your advice and work to those ethics. Cheers Sean

 

[murf]

You have not done a good job there, so you don't have a leg to stand on. No judge would rule in your favour based on the photo you have shown regardless of what you have charged the client.

 

[sstilingservice]

Bloody hell !!! Customers can be a pain in the butt sometimes. But if a customer of mine is not happy then I will allways do my best to please them. I have even lifted floors and re-laid befor now. Jobs can allways go wrong and yes you can have a sleepless night but it's best just to bite the bullet and sort it then everone is happy, and you can draw a big fat line under it and move on. I do hope you do come to a sensible outcome coss these sort of issues can really ruin your week. Good luck and speak with a smile nod and keep your cool

 

[Prem Tiler]

ok I looked at the mic on 400% magnification and agree the job is not gonna win you job of the month.

I truly belive you need to speak with the organ grinder as its more than likely the builder raised these problems to begin with we have all seen it a 1000 times before. other trades persons picking holes in other work. I'm not saying hes wrong to highlight it but he has probably made matters worse. this dont excuse the less than 100% job. but if you speak with the bill payer you will find out what they want and I along with probaly every one else on here would rather walk away from a job out of pocket than walk away from a job leaving a customer that has ammo to bad mouth you to any one else.