Hello

[*Alice*]

Hello everyone :wave:

I'm in the middle of renovating a house at the moment, and we've reached the point of tiling the bathroom...

Having experienced a few dodgy East End 'tradesmen' along the way I'm keen to do my own research and try to avoid future nightmares. We've got gorgeous marble tiles and I'm not willing to watch them drop off the wall thanks to some dodgy tiler! :furious3:

When I google tile-related things I often seem to end up on here, and find useful information on how to do things, usually from several people, then I know what I'm reading isn't someone's controversial pet theory. So I'm back for more :cheesy:

I need to:

• Figure out how to distinguish the wheat from the chaff
• Find out what we need to buy re: backing boards etc
• Check what we need to do to prep the walls
• Hopefully find a good tiler who'll solve all our problems!
• Learn the details of caring for marble

I'll have a read through some past threads before asking the same questions you've already discussed time and time again, but I might be asking your advice sooner or later! We've got the kitchen floor, complete with underfloor heating to do after the bathroom. :helpsmilie: We MIGHT have a go at that ourselves, I suspect we're better off getting a pro in though.

:seeya: Alice

Cheers

 

[garretridge]

hello and welcome to the forum!

 

[aph257]

Hi Alice and :welcome:
Some things to sort out:
1. Work out how heavy 1m2 of your tiles are.
2. how are your walls constructed? i.e. plasterboard, plaster, etc.
3. then refer to Is there a weight limit when tiling a wall?http://www.tiles.org.uk/help/answer-weight.shtml
4. tanking for shower area is IMO essential.
5. you can post a request for a tiler here I'm Looking for a Wall and Floor Tiler

and finally there's no such thing as a daft question.

 

[diamondtiling]

Welcome to the forum Alice

 

[Noaksy]

Hi Alice,
With reagrds to caring for marble, Always inpregnate the tile with a good sealer I use lithofin but there are others you can use, also before I start working with marble, I lay as many out as possible on news paper and use a mini painting roller and cover the top of them with the sealer trying not to handle them too much, as moister from your hands can leave finger print marks espeacially light colour marble. This can also be a good time to sort them out into shading differences as with any natual stone there is variations and some will be ligher and darker than others, once fixed you can seal again. Just be carefull not to leave blops of shampoo of shower gel on them for long periods of time as the acids in the soaps etc can stain so clean as soon as possible, plus also use a cleaner designed for natual stone as some other detergets can have high acidity in them like soaps, other than that you should be fine just reseal every year of two.

 

[aph257]

thats good advice that Noaksy

 

[*Alice*]

Wow, thanks for the quick replies! :smile5:

More woffle from me, to check that we haven't done anything wrong with the bathroom floor... I think it should be ok, but would be good to be sure now before the rest of the bathroom is fitted on top of it!

The bathroom floor was tiled at the weekend. The :furious3: chippies insisted the way to prepare the floor was to take up the floorboards and lay 18mm marine ply over the joists. They did that, then when we came to lay out the underfloor heating the instructions specified that ply directly on joists wasn't sufficiently rigid. :31: Cue a panicked visit to B&Q and about 2 hours battling with the staff to get what we needed. The computer said they had everything in stock...
We eventually got knauf aquapanel insulation boards, galvanised screws and nylon washers (they couldn't find the actual fittings anywhere) and a flexible adhesive suitable for use on wood. The ply is screwed down to the joists, then the aquapanel stuck down with adhesive and also screwed on for good measure. Then we laid out and tested the UFH, which worked just fine. :teeth_smile: Nothing like the last minute!
The tiler arrived the next morning and told us he'd never heard of using insulation boards, no-one else he'd tiled for who'd had underfloor heating had used them and we'd wasted our money! I'm unconvinced. In the bathroom I admit it's not absolutely essential, at least any heat lost downwards will still be heating the house. He said not to use them on the concrete floor in the kitchen though :surprised: which I thought was a necessity?
The tiles in the bathroom are Gemini Strass, which I think is a glazed porcelain? I hope so, it sounds easier to care for than the polished option!

So, can I check...
a) do you think our floor was sufficiently rigid in the end?
b) anyone know for sure if 'Strass' is glazed? It's a tan coloured tile with a black veined glossy surface. (I hope so, as the tiler didn't seal it.)
c) Someone on here mentioned a glazed surface protector, is it worth getting some?
d) Should we seal the (grey) grout? If so, is there any product in particular you'd recommend?
e) Any cleaning products I should avoid using?

The floor seems to have come out largely level, and it certainly wasn't level originally, so we're fairly happy with it. I haven't given it a final brush off and polish yet though. I'll try to take some pictures (and figure out how to post them) later. They are lovely tiles, even if they did cost a fortune. I think we have a couple left over if anyone can make good use of them. Will check tonight, but I think there are about 3 (580mm x 360mm Gemini Strass Nero).

I think I might go on to talk about Marble separately in another post...
Being precise isn't one of my strengths :embaressed_smile:

Cheers all, it's lovely to find such a friendly and helpful forum. :12: Especially when there are so many :cowboy: taking advantage of people.

 

[*Alice*]

And onto marble, if anyone is still with me by this point...

Thank you very much Aph257 and Noaksy, lying them out beforehand sounds like a great idea. Then I guess dust off with a microfibre cloth and apply sealant as per instructions - thin coat seems to be the norm. I'll try to minimise the amount of stuff being stored in the room next to the bathroom!

The tiles are HEAVY, I know having helped carry them in. (I'm a 40kg weakling, it was hard work!) At a guess I'd say 20-25kg per sqm. The walls are plaster skim, so taking adhesive and grout into consideration it sounds like we definitely need some sort of backing board. I suspected that was probably the case, and so asking what we need to do to prepare the walls has been one of my questions to try to eliminate :cowboy:. So far no-one has said to board it, (although we did have one suggestion of PVA) so I was beginning to question myself.
Is there any type of boarding in particular you'd suggest? I was wondering about 12mm hardibacker, is that sufficient? Cheaper alternatives would be good, but not at the cost of quality.
Also, on smaller areas like up the side of the window do you still need the backing boards. If we don't use them there we'll have to work out how to disguise the 12mm change in depth :dizzy2: if we do it'll be a pain in the neck to cut etc.
The more I think about these things the more questions I think of, sorry. :embaressed_smile:

Does using a waterproof backing board count as tanking? The bath has a small upstand along the wall edge so you can tile down onto it and don't get the dreaded gap where the sealant has shrunk. That seems a good start, but it doesn't have the same thing on the ends, and as it's a shower bath having a longterm good watertight seal there will be necessary. Is there something designed to protect that, or do you just need to make sure you reseal it as soon as you notice a gap, before a problem can develop?

Do you fit the shower screen on top of the tiles, or before tiling?

One of the tilers we phoned said tiling using marble was different and you had to use the dot and dab method. That doesn't seem to be favoured on here as far as I can tell. Is this one to avoid at all costs, or is there something I don't know?

We've been told £42/sqm for tiling with natural stone, which seems hugely expensive. Is this really the going rate? I know going for the cheapest price isn't necessarily a good idea, but knowing what is reasonable would help. The worst workers often seem to try to charge a fortune, which complicates matters. :cry_smile:

So, after all that, my plan (subject to refining) is:

• Try to find a good tiler on here
• Put up some sort of tile backer board (following manufacturer's instructions)
• Get some sealer and seal the tiles prior to the tiler arriving
• Watch tiler put tiles on wall, grout, seal
• Create a more convenient shelf than the windowsill for shower gel etc to stand on
• lecture the male of the house
• make sure I buy the cleaning products (and check labels)
• Admire and enjoy!
• Write resealing on next years calendar
• start worrying about the kitchen floor

I'm exhausted just thinking about it!
At least I have a bit more of an outline in my head now, and am less worried we're going to end up with a disaster bathroom like some I've seen discussed on here.

Thank you so much guys!

:biggrin5:

 

[Dan]

Hi Alice and welcome to the forum. Thanks for eventually signing up.

Sounds like you're asking all the right questions, so I'll let the professionals answer them.

You should be able to find a good tiler or two on here

Make sure you do a bit of research on anybody you consider though. Our 'Trusted Advisors' would be the first choice for me, they have green usernames. Though that's not to say the rest of the members are not suited.

 

[*Alice*]

Thanks Dan. I've posted the job over on the 'tilers wanted' forum, so I'm hoping I might get some response there. Any tips on how to assess potential tilers. As I said, I've been asking about wall prep so far, and found most aren't giving me the best advice, so that's them off the list! I got some names off the 'Guild of Master Craftsmen' website, but the first one we tried couldn't take on any more work at the moment. I must check if Fil has got hold of any of the others and if they passed the wall prep test! :smilewinkgrin:
Finding good tradesmen is a nightmare! (Is there a tearing hair out smiley?!) Thankfully the only ones we've had who were utterly hopeless were the chippies. They were shoddy workers and dishonest. Fortunately we realised they were cheating us and booted them out pronto. :32:
Finding this forum was a real godsend. If we get a good tiler and the new chippie turns out to be ok we're mostly there. :lol:

 

[Colour Republic]

Good luck Alice

If you need recommendations for a good carpenter or decorator in London, i'd be happy to give you two names. They work for me on occassion down in Brighton, I wouldn't give out any names of people I wouldn't put my Company name too put it that way. They aren't cheap but good tradesmen rarely are.

As for great tilers, you're in good hands on this forum

 

[doug boardley]

welcome to TF Alice:welcome:

 

[Stewart]

:welcome: to the forum Alice

 

[david campbell]

:welcome:alice

 

[mikethetile]

theres a great post on here written by a member Ken Bruty which outlines what you need to ask a potential tiler

I dont know how to bring the posts up , would someone please do it for me thanks

you can post for a tiler on here

dot and dab is not the preffered method of fixing any tile or stone, dont employ a tiler that uses that method