Making Your Own Adhesive With Cement And Sand?

[ryanbrown]

Anyone ever tried to make there own adhesive with sand and portland cement by buying each individual ingredient? maybe adding a flexible additive to it as well?

Most of these ingredients are pretty cheap from a builders merchant.
Can it be done simply or is it not worth the hassle?

 

[Raja]

somthing i have never tried bit like making ur own tiles lol would b easy if knew how to gud luck let us know how u got on

 

[sWe]

Making thinset and getting a consistant result wouldn't be entirely easy, but the old way of tiling isn't that hard. Well, the mixing part anyways. Actually, tiling with the old metod it is a pain in the arse. It involves a bed of damp conrete which you compact, and upon which you pour a screed of portland cement with a slurryish consistency. Real heavy, messy, and time consuming, but it works. Can't imagine it's cheaper than buying ready-to-mix thinset, but the method has it's uses. I avoid it.

 

[JOHNNYCLARKE]

I regularily use a mixture of washed sand/cement /flexible adhesive when bedding limestone flooring that is uneven in thickness or if screed is too far out of level.
If you use sand / cement mix only min bed is 25mm plus old school used a cement slurry on back tile .
But with this mix and as long as you use plastering / washed sand can quite easily get a solid bed under stone down to 6mm thick.
I still use very thin coat flex adhesive all over back of tile and on screed . so you make a sandwich of your mix in between.
MIXING PROPORTIONS:

I PART CEMENT ( 1/2 BAG ) 12.5 KG( PREFERRABLY WHITE COZ GREY HAS REACTION WITH PALE POROUS STONES SOMETIMES)
I PART FLEX ADHESIVE ( 1/2 BAG 10.00 KG.)
3 BAGS X 25 KG WASHED SAND.

MANY STONE FIXERS USE THIS METHOD BUT IT IS NOT GUARANTEED BY ADHESIVE MANUFACTURERS OR ANY ONE EXCEPT YOU IF YOU FEEL HAPPY WITH IT.

IT SAVES ENORMOUS AMOUNT OF MONEY IF SCREEDS OUT OF LEVEL AND YOU HAVE TO LEVEL UP.
BUT YOU CHARGE MORE TO LAY STONE AND SORTING THEIR WRONG LEVELS OUT.


I HAVE USED THIS ON QUARRIES AND CERAMICS BUT DONT TRY ON PORCELAIN AS TOO DENSE AND NON POROUS.
DONT WALK ON TILES THE FOLLOWING DAY AT ALL.
DONT JUST PUT FIVE BLOBS UNDER TILES IT SHOULD BE SOLID BED.
CAN CAUSE SALT PROBLEMS WITH TERRACOTTA.

HOPE THIS IS OF HELP.

JOHNNY

 

[Cliff Anger]

Yes we do all the time !!

Then we sell it to tile fixers !!!

Sorry

Seriously it is a very complicated matter with all the modern tile types - large format tiles and polymer additives. We employ over six hundred staff in our R&D departments - so try it if you like ??

 

[ryanbrown]

cheers Johnny, reason i was wondering becasue i laid 27m2 of slate of vastly varying depth (also random dimensions) it was unbelivable - at least £250 spent in adhesive packing it out to get it level, so was thinking next time might try a different way.
Having said that.. probally best to avoid laying tiles if they vary by more than 7mm.

 

[Cliff Anger]

cheers Johnny, reason i was wondering becasue i laid 27m2 of slate of vastly varying depth (also random dimensions) it was unbelivable - at least £250 spent in adhesive packing it out to get it level, so was thinking next time might try a different way.
Having said that.. probally best to avoid laying tiles if they vary by more than 7mm.

It might have been worth a call to your friendly tile adhesive manufacturer ??

There are so many different adhesives and levelling compounds on the market - and its not always neccesary to use an expensive high polymer based adhesive as a levelling compound.

 

[sWe]

I would probably have used some sort of premixed adhesive usable in thicker beds, specific for slate and such. Last time I did, I used a variety which I can't remember the name of, which was usable in beds from around 5mm to around 20mm. That gave more than enough margin to get the slate level in one go.

 

[reaper72]

I know a guy who uses this method and reinforces it throughout with chicken mesh wire ...my kitchen floor was done by him using this method,I'm dreading ever having to lift it:furious3: He also used this method for my outside back patio and the kids go over it with their bikes and everything-not one popped yet!
But to do this day in day out especially with small domestic jobs would be a real pain in the arse!

 

[Dan]

Wondering if anybody would dare to do this these days with the tile types we have knocking about now.

 

[White Room]

Do see a lot of sbr thrown in as additive's under a pseudonym though.

 

[Rizzle from the Portizzle]

Yes we do all the time !!

Then we sell it to tile fixers !!!

Sorry

Seriously it is a very complicated matter with all the modern tile types - large format tiles and polymer additives. We employ over six hundred staff in our R&D departments - so try it if you like ??

with these six hundred staff why do your exsperts no so little about fixing large thin formats most of
your specs could not be more wrong why do your exsperts say to prime fibra glass substrates but not fibra glass
tiles light weight adesive changes the longer its left mixed up and becomes more useles why do you sell water
proof grout and adhesive in buckets to bq total rubbish as it is not possible i know i will read the small print
on the back for the truth .

 

[Spud]

He can't hear you Ray his fingers are in his ears

 

[White Room]

This posted started 6 years ago

 

[White Room]

Wrong bloody 8 years ago, my maths was never that good

 

[Dan]

Yeah sorry that's my bad for pulling this thread up lol

 

[widler]

I was in gozo in april scuba diving.
I was having a beer and watching a bloke tile a outside communal area with porcelain tiles.
It went
Day one - torch bitumin felt onto area (it was over underground parking)
Day two -blind with a concreting sand
Day three- tile over using same sand and cement mixed in cement mixer

 

[Dan]

That was a long beer!

 

[Time's Ran Out]

We always used to make our own substrates in sand/cement sceeds then slurry coat the tiles prior to laying. You couldn't blame anyone else then.
Today the tile choice, adhesive choice and time parameters mean it's quicker and cost effective to use the correct adhesives , but only on the smaller jobs. But even if you prepare your own substrate you have to use the decoupling membranes to ensure no shrinkage.

 

[widler]

That was a long beer!

Trust me , plenty of beer was drunk, after the days diving of coarse

 

[Russel]

Very interesting thread thanks for pulling it up.

I have always wondered about this and as far as I understand flexible tile adhesive is a very fine sand + portland cement + polymer + rapid or retarding agent. The Portland cement technical say that "sugar" retards cement setting and that "salt" makes it set faster. As far as the polymer additive goes I can only think of SBR from regular builders merchants. I asked both Mapei and BAL technical about their polymer additives but didnt get an answer.
Any ideas on the polymer or sugar and salt??? I would be very interested in your replies.

 

[gazmcd72]

BLAH BLAH THEY MAKE IT WE STICK IT

 

[Spud]

The retardant is cellulose based

 

[Russel]

BLAH BLAH THEY MAKE IT WE STICK IT

Cant say I agree with you m8