Over boarding Chipboard floor with 6mm Marmox board

[richardbell81]

No if your floor is solid no movement cement board is fine you said you was going to put 6 mm marmox down spf no good on chipboard IMO was trying to help the best way to do a bad job as such marmox is a little more sound with adhesive IMO than cement board

yeh, thanks for your help and advice. That's interesting as i would have thought that cement board (hardi, nmp) glued and screwed would be more solid than Marmox + adhesive.

 

[Perry]

yeh, thanks for your help and advice. That's interesting as i would have thought that cement board (hardi, nmp) glued and screwed would be more solid than Marmox + adhesive.

Have you phoned Marmox and Hardi ? if not try and see what they both say

 

[richardbell81]

Have you phoned Marmox and Hardi ? if not try and see what they both say

I'l give them a try although i've phoned a few manufacturers (Ditra, Durabase, BAL, Marmox) and they all think that their product is suitable... which i'm not doubting but I just need to find the best possible solution considering my constraints.

If i'm honest, i'd quite happily pay a pro to come and have a look and give me his opinion but i'm not sure if many tilers around sheffield offer a consultancy service!

 

[Stewart]

yeh, thanks for your help and advice. That's interesting as i would have thought that cement board (hardi, nmp) glued and screwed would be more solid than Marmox + adhesive.

All the products mentioned above are designed to give you the best substrate to tile to and not "strengthen" or make more solid" The substrate that these boards need to be fixed to, must be solid and deflection free before installation on floors commences!.

 

[richardbell81]

All the products mentioned above are designed to give you the best substrate to tile to and not "strengthen" or make more solid" The substrate that these boards need to be fixed to, must be solid and deflection free before installation on floors commences!.

The floor is as deflection free as it can be considering the joists are over hundred years old and not specced up to modern standards. I've done the glass full of water test and as I said, there is some minor 'vibration' when walking on the chipboard flooring but it's screwed down solid. I realise there will be some natural movement over time but i'm assuming over boarding makes a more stable substrate to tile onto.

2 Layers made up of 18mm Flooring + 6mm Boards glued and screwed is surely 'stronger' (in one sense) as it's 24mm of support as opposed to a single layer of 18mm woodchip? That's why I can't get my head round how a de-coupling membrane would help in my case other than being a better surface to tile on and protect against any moisture affecting the chipboard even though it's the water proof treated stuff... and yes I know, chipboard can't be waterproof.

I should have just chucked down laminate over the bloody thing!!! :mad2:

 

[izzi1]

I would definately use No more ply 6mm glued with mega strength adhesive and screwed with no more ply screws. I have used this method in both bathrooms in my own home over chipboard flooring and the tiled floors are solid as a rock with no movement or cracking of grout lines. Its very good stuff, easy to use and quick. Tiletown are a cheap reliable supplier and make sure you buy the cutting tool.
Single part fastflex is very expensive, I always use Mapei Keraflex maxi.

 

[richardbell81]

I would definately use No more ply 6mm glued with mega strength adhesive and screwed with no more ply screws. I have used this method in both bathrooms in my own home over chipboard flooring and the tiled floors are solid as a rock with no movement or cracking of grout lines. Its very good stuff, easy to use and quick. Tiletown are a cheap reliable supplier and make sure you buy the cutting tool.
Single part fastflex is very expensive, I always use Mapei Keraflex maxi.

That is music to my ears! I've just ordered Some no more ply 6mm, adhesive and screws! Although I didn't order the cutting tool... is their anything else I can use instead? I also ordered a 'solid bed tipped trowel' for use with the BAL spff a;though I will look into the mapei stuff if you say it's much cheaper! Do you know what trowel would be best with the keraflex?

 

[richardbell81]

That is music to my ears! I've just ordered Some no more ply 6mm, adhesive and screws! Although I didn't order the cutting tool... is their anything else I can use instead? I also ordered a 'solid bed tipped trowel' for use with the BAL spff a;though I will look into the mapei stuff if you say it's much cheaper! Do you know what trowel would be best with the keraflex?

Also, did you prime the NMP before fixing the tiles?

 

[izzi1]

Dont bother buying the primer you dont need it, always use a solid bed trowel for floors, i would seriously advise you to buy the cutter, the boards are dense cement board so if you think you can use a stanley knife or a saw you will be tearing your hair out. Use the cutter with a straight edge, scribe firmly and snap over a batten laid under the full length of the cut. Follow the instructions on the NPM website and you will be fine. Also do the whole job in one session, dont glue them down then screw hours later or the next day, the reason i say this is that the glue expands while curing, so you want the whole lot glued and screwed in 1 go.
Dont know how much you are paying for BAL but Kerraflex maxi can be bought for aboout £** from tile giant (they price match).

 

[richardbell81]

Dont bother buying the primer you dont need it, always use a solid bed trowel for floors, i would seriously advise you to buy the cutter, the boards are dense cement board so if you think you can use a stanley knife or a saw you will be tearing your hair out. Use the cutter with a straight edge, scribe firmly and snap over a batten laid under the full length of the cut. Follow the instructions on the NPM website and you will be fine. Also do the whole job in one session, dont glue them down then screw hours later or the next day, the reason i say this is that the glue expands while curing, so you want the whole lot glued and screwed in 1 go.
Dont know how much you are paying for BAL but Kerraflex maxi can be bought for aboout £** from tile giant (they price match).

ok that's great, i'm guessing the solid bed tipped trowel with do the job then!

One last thing, what flexible grout would you recomend with the keraflex maxi?

Thanks again, rich

 

[izzi1]

Trowel will be fine, as for grout i have used mapei ultracolour, it comes in loads of different colours and you can also buy mapei Silicon (mapesil) in matching colour, just looked at bal prices they are rediculous in comparison to mapei, only ever used kerraflex maxi and results have been fine so save your money mate.

 

[richardbell81]

Trowel will be fine, as for grout i have used mapei ultracolour, it comes in loads of different colours and you can also buy mapei Silicon (mapesil) in matching colour, just looked at bal prices they are rediculous in comparison to mapei, only ever used kerraflex maxi and results have been fine so save your money mate.

cheers mate, thanks very much for the advice.

 

[izzi1]

Any time rich, any other problems just ask.

 

[richardbell81]

Any time rich, any other problems just ask.

hey again... having a bit of trouble getting hold of the Mapei kerraflex maxi and the Ultra colour plus in Medium grey... have you got any ideas or trusted online suppliers I could use?

I went to my local tile Giant and the guy there said that he couldn't understand why I wanted the kerraflex maxi when the kerraquick was flexible, more expensive and as fart as he could see a superior product? I couldn't quite see his logic so i tried arguing my point but basically, he wasn't prepared to order any of the maxi in. He also said that they would need to order the grout in Medium grey which would take 2 weeks! I then tried another stockist (Stokes Tiles, Sheffield) suggested by the guys at Mapei but they just said they didn't stock the kerraflex (only the keraquick) and i'd need to order a minimum of 4 bags of the medium grey grout... which was helpful when i'm only tiling 2.2 m2!

Any help would be much appreciated!

 

[richardbell81]

Quick Up-date... i've found the stuff online at Tile Adhesive | Tile Grout | Lithofin Cleaners & Sealers

Mapei Keraflex Maxi Grey Adhesive 20 KG
Mapei Ultracolor Plus 112 Medium Grey Grout 5 KG

Grand Total Incl. VAT & Delivery = £**.**

Bit more than I was expecting, but not sure what else to do!