Tile edge/biscuit visible after grouting. What can be done?!

[MichaelJames]

Hello everyone, I'm hoping for some advice and guidance please!

I've had three sides of a bath area tiled in 6x25cm tiles by a professional* tiler (*only does tiling). In general the workmanship is good (setting out, no lipping etc.) but after he grouted there are areas where I can see the tile biscuit. Where I can see the biscuit it is less than 1mm. I've attached photos.

The tiles are from fired earth so not cheap. The glaze could come further over the tile edge but there are large areas where the grouting is absolutely fine so I don't think the tiles are at fault. I think he has wiped too much grout out.

He used Mapei Adesilex P9 and Mapei Ultra Colour Plus. The walls are aqua panel on the bath ends, plastered brick on the main wall. The area wasn't tanked.

Short question: Should I be worried?

Longer questions:
Will water find it's way through the biscuit?
How can it be remedied?
Can grout be cut out neatly and regrouted - they are small tiles and there's a lot of grout!
Would grout sealer help?
What kind of problems might I find in years to come?

I'm trying to stay level and positive but I'm really gutted. I do a lot of stuff around the house and 'treated' myself by having someone in to give me break...now I wish I'd done it myself.

Thanks in advance for any help. This is a great website!

 

[Dan]

I think it either wasn't tiled well and flat, or the grout joint was too big for the tile perhaps, and maybe tile quality not brilliant. Or a mixture of the lot.

I don't tile anymore so wait for an actual tiler to reply.

But perhaps a stiffer/thicker grout mix going over it again would suffice (not got anything to lose from it) and when you wash the grout off the tile surface, go diagonal and never down the grout joint. (At least until it's going off and then one light smooth wipe down with no pressure on the sponge).

Take a look online for a "Washboy": Genesis 23L Wash Boy - https://www.tilefixdirect.com/product/GTN993

Then youtube how to use a washboy:

 

[MichaelJames]

Thanks Dan for such a quick reply.

I agree that isn't a good job! The tiling is actually very flat and well layed out. But it does seem to me that the grout joints have been wiped out too much. They are 2mm joints so not huge.

Will more grout adhere properly to the old grout? I've read not but that would solves things if so!

 

[Dan]

Not really brilliantly no. Not sure if adding an additive to the grout when doing it will help it stick better - lads?

2mm is the thinnest you can go. So yeah, can't be that.

If it's flat, can't be that.

So it's either the grout mix (too wet maybe), or just the tile is a bit shyte, or a combination of them both.

I dare say if it is the tiles fault - even raking out the grout with a tool and regrouting wouldn't really fix it.

The colouring and glaze perhaps needed to go around the tile edging a bit. Not actually sure.

Looking at the pic again - what's going on with the end of the tiling on the right? No tile trim used?
Also, what's that thin strip doing in the middle? That a border that's not showing too well on the picture?

Not questions related to the grout - just curious.
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Just looked again, I think too much grout has been washed out.

Also the corner needed no grout in it, and then a Silicon bead running down it make it look neat. Internal corners can't be grouted because of movement. The British Standards says always Silicon.

You can get silicones to match grout colours bang on these days (there must be 20 whites alone out there these days).

Again - I'm not a tiler. Don't act on my posts. I'd hate to think I got it wrong (again!!!) lol

 

[Flintstone]

It's a different layout to the usual, did you specify that ?

I'm afraid it's simply a characteristic of these basic white ceramics, some times you can see the biscuit. The grout looks ok, you could ask the tiler to give it a once over again with the same grout to see if that will fill the joints slightly. Don't add anything to the grout, especially not primer, as that's for priming only.

 

[MichaelJames]

A few answers first:

There is a border tile yes, kind of a dado rail effect. And yes, I specified the layout - it looks very nice

There is some grout in the corners but not much and I know it needs taking out before Silicon.

Trim is all good. Nothing has been siliconed yet so looks a bit odd in the photos.

The only problem is the shallow grout joint. I should also add that he's only just finished and I'm prepared to ask him to fix anything - I'd just like to know the best course of action at this point. The frustrating thing is that it would be so simple if he'd noticed while he was grouting!

 

[Dan]

It's a different layout to the usual, did you specify that ?

I'm afraid it's simply a characteristic of these basic white ceramics, some times you can see the biscuit. The grout looks ok, you could ask the tiler to give it a once over again with the same grout to see if that will fill the joints slightly. Don't add anything to the grout, especially not primer, as that's for priming only.

Sorry I meant the additive you stick in grouts! Well spotted mate!

BAL's GT1 it was called in my day. What's that called now?! lol
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Trim is all good.

This bit on the right, is that having a shower screen or something attached to cover the tile ends up? Or is that going to be covered in Silicon? (not the best finish?)

Not picking at the work here. Just asking.

 

[MichaelJames]

Sorry I meant the additive you stick in grouts! Well spotted mate!

BAL's GT1 it was called in my day. What's that called now?! lol
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View attachment 109317

This bit on the right, is that having a shower screen or something attached to cover the tile ends up? Or is that going to be covered in Silicon? (not the best finish?)

Not picking at the work here. Just asking.

The cut tile (9mm) butts up to the wooden trim (12mm) of a cupboard. What you can see is an unfilled joint (waiting for Silicon) not the edge of the tile. Thanks for checking though

 

[Time's Ran Out]

Engineer by any chance?
Just express your concerns to the Tiler next and I’am sure he’ll put right what looks to be a professional job.
Knowing the quality Fired Earth sell in the name of repackaged style he’s done a good job from 2 feet!
It’s often the case that DIY can always do it better themselves but a professional Tiler will work to tolerances set by British standards to the best of their ability.
Sometimes there are customers that you just can’t satisfy!

 

[Andy Allen]

I fix alot of metro tiles, and this is a very common problem with them and many other 2nd rate ceramics, and quite frankly it drives me up the wall, I can tile perfectly flat with full grout joints, only for the biscuit edge to be showing, the problem is the glaze doesn't reach the edge of the tile and some box's / batches can be worse than others. And no amount of grout filling will hide it completely if the glaze is at fault.
Have you tried telling the supplier of the problem .????
As tilers we can only work with what we have been given...

 

[MichaelJames]

The cut tile (9mm) butts up to the wooden trim (12mm) of a cupboard. What you can see is an unfilled joint (waiting for Silicon) not the edge of the tile. Thanks for checking though

Engineer by any chance?
Just express your concerns to the Tiler next and I’am sure he’ll put right what looks to be a professional job.
Knowing the quality Fired Earth sell in the name of repackaged style he’s done a good job from 2 feet!
It’s often the case that DIY can always do it better themselves but a professional Tiler will work to tolerances set by British standards to the best of their ability.
Sometimes there are customers that you just can’t satisfy!

Thanks John,

Not an engineer, just want the job done for good and no gremlins a few years down the line.

I realise I came across very arrogant when I said wish I'd done the job myself! I'm certainly no professional tiler but if and when I balls something up I've usually only lost my own time rather than quite a few expensive (but perhaps not very good) tiles and the tilers fee.

I'm sure the tiler can out it right but I'd just like to be reassured In asking for the right thing.

Engineer by any chance?
Just express your concerns to the Tiler next and I’am sure he’ll put right what looks to be a professional job.
Knowing the quality Fired Earth sell in the name of repackaged style he’s done a good job from 2 feet!
It’s often the case that DIY can always do it better themselves but a professional Tiler will work to tolerances set by British standards to the best of their ability.
Sometimes there are customers that you just can’t satisfy!

Not an engineer, just want the job done for good and no gremlins a few months or years down the line.

I realise I sounded very arrogant when I said I wish I'd done the job myself. I didn't mean any disrespect.

If I'm being fussy and there is no problem with a bit of biscuit showing then I'm very happy to leave it as it is.

I'm sure the tiler will put it right I'd just like some reassurance that I'm asking for the right thing.
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I fix alot of metro tiles, and this is a very common problem with them and many other 2nd rate ceramics, and quite frankly it drives me up the wall, I can tile perfectly flat with full grout joints, only for the biscuit edge to be showing, the problem is the glaze doesn't reach the edge of the tile and some box's / batches can be worse than others. And no amount of grout filling will hide it completely if the glaze is at fault.
Have you tried telling the supplier of the problem .????
As tilers we can only work with what we have been given...

I feared this was the problem but the vast majority of it is perfect. Perhaps it is a batch/tile problem.

Do you think adding grout will work?
And if I leave it, will it have any negative consequences?

 

[Andy Allen]

Thanks John,

Not an engineer, just want the job done for good and no gremlins a few years down the line.

I realise I came across very arrogant when I said wish I'd done the job myself! I'm certainly no professional tiler but if and when I balls something up I've usually only lost my own time rather than quite a few expensive (but perhaps not very good) tiles and the tilers fee.

I'm sure the tiler can out it right but I'd just like to be reassured In asking for the right thing.

Not an engineer, just want the job done for good and no gremlins a few months or years down the line.

I realise I sounded very arrogant when I said I wish I'd done the job myself. I didn't mean any disrespect.

If I'm being fussy and there is no problem with a bit of biscuit showing then I'm very happy to leave it as it is.

I'm sure the tiler will put it right I'd just like some reassurance that I'm asking for the right thing.
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I feared this was the problem but the vast majority of it is perfect. Perhaps it is a batch/tile problem.

Do you think adding grout will work?
And if I leave it, will it have any negative consequences?

I've been there....
Tried adding more grout, leaving the grout to virtually completely dry before wiping off ..
You can get the grout absolutely flush with the tile but If the glaze isn't covering the tile edge then you will always see a slight biscuit edge.
All I will say is the more it fully drys the less noticeable it is...
But IMO it's a fault with the tiles NOT the fixing..

 

[Wayne Brown]

that

Still called GT1 Dan it's been a while mate

 

[Wayne Brown]

Have to agree with Andy grouting can be tricky wash it 5 minutes to early and you risk removing the grout just that little bit more than you would like, these tiles are never flat and often differ in size slightly having a slightly bigger grout joint allows for minor discrepancy in the tiles , on the whole I think it looks fine to me, white grouting on white tile will always show every little detail let it dry fully then address any little faults .kop

 

[Tiler Durden]

Go over it again. It might help. Sometimes when a biscuit won’t stop revealing itself I leave the grout in for much longer and wipe the wall down with an emulsifying pad before the sponge. I agree with what’s already been said, poor glaze, doesn’t help you at all.