tiling over floor grade chipboard

[sharpfamily]

thanks to all contributors.
I can't understand a mechanism that will cause the tiles to crack.
- as regards gravity - the floor is solid and vibration proof
- temp - tiling at summer temps, so any differential thermal contraction will only occur over an individual tile, ie given that the grout's tensile strength is weaker that the tile. Thermal expansion and possibility of the tiles buckling not an issue given summer temps.
- moisture. the floor is bone dry, and any small expansion in the chipboard would only have affect across one tile width, and there should be sufficient flexibility in the bal spf to cope with that.

hence I'm going to proceed with the bal spf. I'll be sure to let you know if the tiles crack within the year.

 

[grumpygrouter]

thanks to all contributors.
I can't understand a mechanism that will cause the tiles to crack.
- as regards gravity - the floor is solid and vibration proof
- temp - tiling at summer temps, so any differential thermal contraction will only occur over an individual tile, ie given that the grout's tensile strength is weaker that the tile. Thermal expansion and possibility of the tiles buckling not an issue given summer temps.
- moisture. the floor is bone dry, and any small expansion in the chipboard would only have affect across one tile width, and there should be sufficient flexibility in the bal spf to cope with that.

hence I'm going to proceed with the bal spf. I'll be sure to let you know if the tiles crack within the year.

We have tried to give you advise based on combined dozens of years of experience and tried to explain what problems you are going to have. You have chosen to ignore what has been suggested sadly.

Hopefully things will be OK for you. Good luck, I hope you are still crack free at christmas.

 

[spacedout]

I think that you should listen to these guys they know what they are taking about. However. If you want to take the risk then so be it. Chipboard is not suitable to tile on and even ardex will not advise you to tile over it, please ply first then the right adhesive (ardex s16 with ardion 90) you will have no problems

 

[GazTech]

thanks to all contributors.
I can't understand a mechanism that will cause the tiles to crack.
- as regards gravity - the floor is solid and vibration proof
- temp - tiling at summer temps, so any differential thermal contraction will only occur over an individual tile, ie given that the grout's tensile strength is weaker that the tile. Thermal expansion and possibility of the tiles buckling not an issue given summer temps.
- moisture. the floor is bone dry, and any small expansion in the chipboard would only have affect across one tile width, and there should be sufficient flexibility in the bal spf to cope with that.

hence I'm going to proceed with the bal spf. I'll be sure to let you know if the tiles crack within the year.

Hello, I am a Product Support Technician for BAL. Unfortunately for you, everything the boys have said is true. If you will not seek the advice of the professionals, or a technical representative of the company who makes the adhesive you are going to install incorrectly, (and if money is the biggest issue) I would ask to be refunded the tiles and adhesive and put a cushionfloor down that looks like tiles. What was the reason for seeking advice if you are not prepared to heed it ? I also think de-bonding of the tiles will occur before 12 months is out......I hope I am wrong !

 

[CJ]

:mad2:

 

[sharpfamily]

I can see why is chipboard not suitable for tiling in some circumstances.

However my chipboard floor is solid, no deflections....therefore I see no need for adding ply for extra stiffness.
the chipboard is bone dry, been down for 17 years and is not subject to any wetting or moisture.
please explain in more detail why you foresee cracking or debonding before Christmas.

 

[Holohana]

i dont think they are going to bother anymore do you?

 

[CJ]

Is this a wind up :mad2:

 

[grumpygrouter]

I can see why is chipboard not suitable for tiling in some circumstances.

However my chipboard floor is solid, no deflections....therefore I see no need for adding ply for extra stiffness.
the chipboard is bone dry, been down for 17 years and is not subject to any wetting or moisture.
please explain in more detail why you foresee cracking or debonding before Christmas.

What you appear to be not understanding is that the atmosphere around your floor will vary constantly with temprature and moisture content of the air. Even though your floor is "bone dry" the atmosphere containes moisture and you have heard of this referred to as humidity. Different weather conditions WILL affect your floor even though it is dry. This is the reason you have ventilation under a suspended floor and also the reason why you have insulation boards between your joists.

Ceramic tiles (or natural products) do not have any flexibility and WILL expand and contract at a different rate to your floor. Yes your floor WILL expand and contract with differing atmospheric conditions. Even your chipboard surface will move at a different rate to the wooden joists they are attached to as they are different materials. These movements are inperceptable to the eye but they ARE there.

You say that any movement would only be taken up within 1 tile width, if that tile width goes along the entire length of your floor you have 1 big long crack to either look at for years or a lot of re-tiling to do.

The deflection issue you mentioned has ways of being overcome as mentioned in my previous posts without overlaying with ply. The real problem you have is the fact that you are going to use an ADHESIVE THAT IS NOT DESIGNED TO FIX TO TIMBER.

We here on the forum are only trying to stop you from having big problems in the future and wasting a lot of money and time. Bear in mind that if one of the professional guys on here came to do the job for you, using exactly the same materials and procedures you intend to do, when it cracked you would be striaght on the phone to get him back to fix it at his own cost. We are only advising you what we would do to do the job correctly and reduce potential problems to a minimum.

Your chipboard floor is solid. That is fine. Tile straight onto it by all means but please, please, use the correct adhesive. BAL Single part Flexible is not suitable for this job.

As an aside, it will be much less hassle to go and change your 10 bags of adhesive than to retile 35 or so square metres of floor. ( I assume that is the area looking at the number of bags you have).

 

[sharpfamily]

Grumpy,
Thank you for sharing your practical knowledge so patiently.
That's what will make this forum work.
Others perhaps should take note the good example you set.
best,
graham