Tiling Standards

[Rizzle from the Portizzle]

well let me get this right bs again and again lower standards and these are the ones you follow .i wonder just how many hand shakes it takes to get your doggy tiles approved and all other rubbish that they spec to minumum standard when there not cutting and pasting . bs standard who right them might be worth a look and who do they work for .the answers are out there

 

[Wishiwasatoptiler]

This makes for intresting reading, so not wanting to name or shame, and this may not be the section for it but which tile manufactures should I be wary of.

 

[Unused Account 1]

Tiled the whole downstairs of a new build ,floating floor,the customer supplied the adhesive with guarentee in writing that it would not crack or lift from the company ,forget wich adhesive a few years ago ,perfect for the tiler is covered

 

[AliGage]

I've never found any tiles so far out if tolerance like that.
Some cheap cheap tiles have maybe been upto 3mm. I'd just use these for cuts.

With most porcelain being rectified these days it's rare to have them so far out of whack IMO.

 

[Tile Shop]

Tiles have to conform to BS EN 14411. 82 pages but this is a snippet that will cover (at a guess) about 95% of all ceramics available today. There will be standards for Natural stone too... I will need to try and find these

Extruded ceramics:
Tolerance from the average size = +2% to a maximum of +4mm
Tolerance for thicknes = 10%

Dust Pressed ceramics: (which most ceramics and porcelain are these days)
Tolerance from the average size (for tiles between 70 and 150mm) = +0.9mm
Tolerance from the average size (for tiles 150mm or greater) = +0.6% to a maximium of 2mm
Tolerance for thickness = +/- 5% to a maximimun of 0.5mm
(This also applies to rectified.... don't be fooled)

This shouldn't be confused with nominal sizing...... This is just a guide to the size contained in the box. The average size of the tiles contained must be within -10mm (based on the example given in BS EN14411 but I will need to dig deeper for the exact numbers).

Take Johnsons as an example. They make it clear on the box and show the nominal size as 200x100 (which is what most suppliers will advertise them as) but the actual working size may be 197x97 but credit to them, they also mark this on the packs. Most factories only provide the nominal size, so what you actually buy may be a very slightly different size, but still within the nominal sizing tolerance.

Its a bugger when we get a customer, orders some tiles to match some existing tiles which are 200x100, see a tile advertised at 200x100, that then gets delivered 3mm smaller each way. One of the reasons that samples are advised and that tiles shouldn't just be ordered on a whim.

Another tolerance fact for you. Did you know that if you buy a tile that has a slight manufacturing fault, like pits in the glazes or a printing error, as long as the fault only covers no more than 5% of the face, THAT IS ACCEPTABLE according to BS???? guess what else BS stands for!

Its way too early for this.... I need a coffee and 10 minutes brain rest....... "Tolerance"...... hate that word. Just another wall to hide behind.

 

[Tile Shop]

Wanna hear another absolute stinker on this??? Based on the examples given in EN14411..... again.

Example.... A range of tiles which for examples sake is called Asbestos Bog.... available in 3 colours, Black, White and Poo Brown (3 colours associated with an asbestos bog... see what I did there? white pan, black cistern, and...... nevermind!)

The nominal size is 600x300. The customer has worked out a design for a single wall based on this advertised (and legally acceptable) size.

Due to the manufucturing process and timings of the batches, the Black is 599x299. The White is 595x296. The Poo Brown is 600x295.

These tiles are within nominal sizing.
These tiles are within tolerance because tolerance is only forced upon a single tile design from a single batch. Technically, all 3 tiles are different so the tolerance doesn't apply between them.
Tragically, these tiles conform to British and European Standards.

Bummer ay!

 

[Dan]

Wanna hear another absolute stinker on this??? Based on the examples given in EN14411..... again.

Example.... A range of tiles which for examples sake is called Asbestos Bog.... available in 3 colours, Black, White and Poo Brown (3 colours associated with an asbestos bog... see what I did there? white pan, black cistern, and...... nevermind!)

The nominal size is 600x300. The customer has worked out a design for a single wall based on this advertised (and legally acceptable) size.

Due to the manufucturing process and timings of the batches, the Black is 599x299. The White is 596x296. The Poo Brown is 600x295.

These tiles are within nominal sizing.
These tiles are within tolerance because tolerance is only forced upon a single tile design from a single batch. Technically, all 3 tiles are different so the tolerance doesn't apply between them.
Tragically, these tiles conform to British and European Standards.

Bummer ay!

That does suck actually.

It's when we tilers tile two colours (doesn't get done much like it used to, with a border tile etc) you end up needing to judge the spacer size well with a few stacks of tiles.

 

[Tile Shop]

We've raised a similar situation with a manufacturer once before... this is what they threw back at us. Thinking it was complete boll***s we investigated further. A day later we were scracthing ours heads thinking "they're right and we can do naff all about it".

We had to let common sense prevail and despite the tiles conforming, we collected the tiles from the customer and offered an alternative and a refund for the inconvenience. Never sold the 2 colours together again, and weirdly enough, never ordered from that factory again.

 

[Old Mod]

That does suck actually.

It's when we tilers tile two colours (doesn't get done much like it used to, with a border tile etc) you end up needing to judge the spacer size well with a few stacks of tiles.

ANYONE who uses Original Style tiles can tell u what a pain that is!
Even tho they're from same design and are meant to work together, they're not the same size in relation to each other.
Prime example, this floor! Most joints are two mm but the joints around the White are one mm. And to make it even more frustrating, even tho the white triangles can be bought, u can't use them because they come up in a different colour so they have to be cut from whole tiles. Which increases wastage because they don't always cut cleanly.

View media item 12172

 

[Tile Shop]

I had to do a 1.5sqm showroom display of a pretty complex victorian pattern once. I know i'm no tiler but that bugger took me 4 days to get it right. It was a mix of about 12 to 15 tiles, squares, triangles, rectangles, all different sizes.

I think because they are pre-cut and used for many differents designs, its never going to be 100% perfect from one style to the next. Mine ended up having joints from 2mm down to 0.5mm. On tiles that are as small as 35x35mm, thats a mahoosive difference. But once grouted and taking the magnifying glass away, looked like a pro had done it (not usually one to blow my own trumpet.... but it is long enough, and working with those, I can be forgiven for doing so.)

Seriously though, I don't envy the tiler who turns up at a customers house, and after measuring up the 30 metre floor and is then told "I want a victorian pattern"..... I can imagine the heartache!

 

[Old Mod]

I had to do a 1.5sqm showroom display of a pretty complex victorian pattern once. I know i'm no tiler but that bugger took me 4 days. It was a mix of about 12 to 15 tiles, squares, triangles, rectangles.

I think because they are pre-cut and used for many differents designs, its never going to be 100% perfect from one style to the next. Mine ended up having joints from 2mm down to 0.5mm. On tiles that are as small as 35x35mm, thats a mahoosive difference. But once grouted and taking the magnifying glass away, looked like a pro had done it (not usually one to blow my own trumpet.... but it is long enough, and working with those, I can be forgiven for doing so.)

Seriously though, I don't envy the tiler who turns up at a customers house, and after measuring up the 30 metre floor and is then told "I want a victorian pattern"..... I can imagine the heartache!

The one above was 24m which is above average.
This was 8m and 2500 pieces
View media item 12163

 

[Tile Shop]

HA HA HA.... This is an absolute cracker.....

Dust pressed ceramics, can be up to 0.5% out of square, to a maximum of 2mm!!!! I come out of a pub straighter than that!

 

[bcd-87]

Iv had to stop useing Topps tile due to this tolerance issue.. It's a joke they told me manufacturers specifications are 5mm per box..

I called them out on it £1000 cash tell this to the next 10 costomers that walk in and see if you Make a sale, needless to say the manger bottled it !!

@Dan where can I get all BS for free that would be helpful

 

[Dan]

Iv had to stop useing Topps tile due to this tolerance issue.. It's a joke they told me manufacturers specifications are 5mm per box..

I called them out on it £1000 cash tell this to the next 10 costomers that walk in and see if you Make a sale, needless to say the manger bottled it !!

@Dan where can I get all BS for free that would be helpful

British Standards in Wall And Floor Tiling BS 5385 For Free

 

[Unused Account 1]

Trying to make straight lines ,with different sizes ,really lol gives us a chance haha

 

[jimthetiler]

bring back flogging,thats what I say.Then well see how straight they get em.
Nice floor by the way.Reminds me of a job I took on once.The whole floor was dug up and put in bins and left in the blokes garden forever.All I was given was a photo copy of what it used to look like,he got jim the tilers version.

 

[Rizzle from the Portizzle]

Wanna hear another absolute stinker on this??? Based on the examples given in EN14411..... again.

Example.... A range of tiles which for examples sake is called Asbestos Bog.... available in 3 colours, Black, White and Poo Brown (3 colours associated with an asbestos bog... see what I did there? white pan, black cistern, and...... nevermind!)

The nominal size is 600x300. The customer has worked out a design for a single wall based on this advertised (and legally acceptable) size.

Due to the manufucturing process and timings of the batches, the Black is 599x299. The White is 595x296. The Poo Brown is 600x295.

These tiles are within nominal sizing.
These tiles are within tolerance because tolerance is only forced upon a single tile design from a single batch. Technically, all 3 tiles are different so the tolerance doesn't apply between them.
Tragically, these tiles conform to British and European Standards.

Bummer ay!

to cut manufucturing cost few factorys produce 600x300 tiles its cheaper to produce 600x600 then cut them
down and rectify depending on who is working that machine and time of day .how good the cutting is but dont worry BS has aloud for this .

 

[Amir Patwa]

If you buy from reputable shop all tiles should have no tolerance!!
You are not buying pototes or carrots !

 

[Lee@emctiles]

With the increasing popularity of large format wall and floor tile we wish to remind you that the tolerances allow for a 0.5% warpage in tile planarity. therefore the European norms allow on a 60x60 tile 3.5mm tolerance between the centre of the tile and its corners.
This causes no problem whatsoever when the tiles are fixed in the normal draughtboard pattern, however, it can create problems if the tile is fixed brick bond or half bond particularly in the case of rectified tiles when the joint width is reduced to 1.5mm. It is advisable in this instance to ask your client to check for acceptability BEFORE fixing or alternatively to consider bonding 1/3 - 2/3 which will have the effect of halving discrepancies in planarity.

Hope this helps. this is generally the rule we use when selling anyway.

 

[Amir Patwa]

With the increasing popularity of large format wall and floor tile we wish to remind you that the tolerances allow for a 0.5% warpage in tile planarity. therefore the European norms allow on a 60x60 tile 3.5mm tolerance between the centre of the tile and its corners.
This causes no problem whatsoever when the tiles are fixed in the normal draughtboard pattern, however, it can create problems if the tile is fixed brick bond or half bond particularly in the case of rectified tiles when the joint width is reduced to 1.5mm. It is advisable in this instance to ask your client to check for acceptability BEFORE fixing or alternatively to consider bonding 1/3 - 2/3 which will have the effect of halving discrepancies in planarity.

Hope this helps. this is generally the rule we use when selling anyway.

When you buy mechanically produced product there should be no tolerance! I run a service through " STONE GURU" and I travel to USA to inspect containers of natural and made made tiles of various sizes! If they are not uniform and calibrated
Then the whole shipment is rejected! Supplier carries the insurance

 

[Dlt]

Hi,

Just a quick question, doing a bathroom at the minute in a factory, put a 2.4m straight edge on the walls and they are not flat invert inwards. Does any one no the tolerance of the plasterboard and tiles? they are 600x300 porcelain square edged.

Thanks

 

[Dlt]

2mm Joints

 

[Flintstone]

The tolerance of plasterboard and tiles?

 

[Dlt]

Plasterboard, I got a 8mm difference in the middle! Just trying to find out what they are allowed

 

[J Sid]

stand to be corrected but thought 2mm over 2mt

 

[White Room]

As above

2-3mm I've had worse.

 

[J Sid]

alot worse.

 

[One Day]

Look for nhbc guidelines. From memory it's 7mm over 2.4m allowed but they are only guidelines for builders. In my experience 70mm over 2.4m is the norm.

 

[SJPurdy]

Put a 2m long straight edge anywhere on the plasterboard and if there is any gap greater than 3mm between the straight edge and the board then it is not flat enough to tile.
On the tiled wall do the same test using a 2m straight edge with 3mm feet each end. If the gap between this and the tiles exceeds 6mm or the straight edge touches the tiling then the tiling does not meet BS.
This is based on my memory of reading BS5385 a while ago (I no longer have an up to date copy).

The same tests apply for the flatness of a floor substrate and floor tiling.
On a large floor the surface should also be flat within +/-15mm of the datum or as per the architects specified tolerance. I don't know the equivalent wall building tolerance.

 

[Flintstone]

And in the real world, that's a load of tosh.