What is tile adhesive for anymore?

[Pauly tiler]

As a City and Guilds trained tiler who was taught hand fixing s/cement,( ah those were the days) could somebody tell me
1 Why adhesive manufacturers require that nearly all backgrounds need priming for SPF's etc.
They are making a glue and the majority of floors are traditional screed.

2 Why screeders think it is acceptable to use a power float machine and push all the screed to the corners.

3 Why adhesive manufacturers "Advise back buttering floor tiles" but then invalidate the guarantee if you haven't. If its a must do, its a must do.

4 Why every operative on the site wants to walk on my new floor before I have even washed my tools off.

Rant over.

 

[Tile Shop]

1. To reduce porosity and increase suction prior to the adhesive being applied. Some surfaces can also be friable (dusty) even after a good brush or a vacuum, priming helps stabilise it so you are not applying adhesive to a layer of dust.

2. Cuz hidden surprises are fun.... or to just deliberately p!ss you off. Or because you don't have enough to do already, he left the corners to either be chopped out or the remainder of the floor to be levelled, to stop you getting too bored. Thoughtful I think 🙂

3. I didn't realise this until I was looking into it for a customer. It's already been assumed that back-buttering is "good practice", but read that it's actually a British Standard that floor tiles MUST be buttered.... and most manufacturers will only guarantee their products on the strict understanding that the British Standards relating to tile fixing a followed:
BS5385, part 3: 2014:
7.2.1.2.1 Notched trowel and buttering method
When floor tiles are fixed using normal cementitious adhesives the adhesive should be applied to the sub-floor as well as to the back of the tile to ensure solid bed fixing. The mixed adhesive should be applied to the sub-floor using a trowel as a floated coat, pressing the adhesive into the surface before combing through with a notched trowel as a spreading gauge to provide a uniform ribbed adhesive bed. The backs of the dry tiles should be buttered with the adhesive to coat the surface and to fill flush any back profile or key to form a contact layer before placing the tile on the ribbed adhesive bed.

4. Because it's fun.... for them. It feels like ice skating with having to actually go ice skating.... and it's free 🙂

 

[Pauly tiler]

"The mixed adhesive should be applied to the sub-floor using a trowel as a floated coat, pressing the adhesive into the surface before combing through with a notched trowel"

How many tilers do that? Show of hand pls, no fibbers!

 

[Dumbo]

I dont I have a special technique that eliminates the need for that , it's called dot and dab

 

[Pau;l]

I will be honest here, I have never seen any tiler use a flat trowel, or even the back of the notch trowel, fully coat and press into the face, the get another trowel and comb out the area. on an membrane yes, but on a screed, nope. Just saying. I know some will say they do, but I have work with hundreds of tilers over the years and its all about balance. I suppose some on here pick up every 10th tile to check the bedding, haven't ever seen that either.

 

[Pauly tiler]

Thats a different thing entirely magte

 

[Qwerty]

"The mixed adhesive should be applied to the sub-floor using a trowel as a floated coat, pressing the adhesive into the surface before combing through with a notched trowel"

How many tilers do that? Show of hand pls, no fibbers!

I have OCD and I am ultra slow so I always do

 

[Pauly tiler]

Tiling onto a Newly Laid Screed Floor By Norcros Adhesives

Tiling onto a newly laid screed floor

www.youtube.com

This is a Norcross how to vid, no back buttering, no flat trowel into the surface then combing.
Easy to slag off any one or thing.

 

[Steve6690]

"The mixed adhesive should be applied to the sub-floor using a trowel as a floated coat, pressing the adhesive into the surface before combing through with a notched trowel"

How many tilers do that? Show of hand pls, no fibbers!

I do. But then again I'm newly trained and very slow

 

[Pauly tiler]

Well done mate.
You must have great prices in for job.

 

[Steve6690]

I haven't started paid work yet. When I said new I meant really really new 🙂

 

[Boggs]

Me too, bet I’m slower. 😛

 

[Pauly tiler]

The industry need new blood like all industries, keep at it

 

[One Day]

I think that adhesive manufacturers factor in the "idiot factor".
In other words, they give guidance on how to use their products, but if they were completely truthful, for instance saying you must achieve 75% coverage, then the "idiots" would only achieve 50%. So by saying you must achieve 100%, the "idiots" will achieve 75% and all is well with the world.

 

[widler]

I remember ‘the back butter theory ‘ being spoke about on here years ago, when porcelain became wide spread , and basically,back buttering was so the tile adhesive stuck to the substrate tile adhesive , nothing to do with coverage , to do with the pourisisity (no idea if that’s a real word 😉 ) so the polymers in the addy had something to stick to as porcelain is not like normal ceramic and addy won’t grab to porcelain like it does to the biscuit

 

[LM]

I think that adhesive manufacturers factor in the "idiot factor".
In other words, they give guidance on how to use their products, but if they were completely truthful, for instance saying you must achieve 75% coverage, then the "idiots" would only achieve 50%. So by saying you must achieve 100%, the "idiots" will achieve 75% and all is well with the world.

Agree!


Where’s the agree button gone I like it?

 

[Flintstone]

A lot of the time by the time you have troweled the adhesive numerous times you have well and truly keyed it in. if you just put a large amount down and troweled it once then that wouldn't be keyed in. That's my thoughts on it. Back buttering, adhesive sticks to adhesive miles better than it sticks to a porcelain tile that could be dusty.