DIY Tiler - 90 sq m of large format porcelaine tiling making me nervous!

[Bathfix Bob]

Speaking as a plumber I'd say be careful when notching joists for pipes' have a look at the building regs for maximum notch depths. If the run is longer than three metres then go up to fifty mm pipe, also make sure the fall is right. Your plumber will of course know this.

 

[PJPro]

Speaking as a plumber I'd say be careful when notching joists for pipes' have a look at the building regs for maximum notch depths. If the run is longer than three metres then go up to fifty mm pipe, also make sure the fall is right. Your plumber will of course know this.

Fortunately, the joists do not support a floor, so I think the plumber has a little more scope to make the holes big. But as you say, he should know the regs but.....

 

[PJPro]

The plumber has been on site from 10:00 to about 17:00. Admittedly, the first couple of hours were spent with me sorting out the detail of where things were going and the implications for the tiling. However, in the remainder of the time, he tested a gas pipe which he installed that looked like it had been pierced by screws put up to secure the wet wall and fixed in the installation frames.

The wet saw is not very well constructed. A bit of lathe has been nailed to the wall. Then, about 200mmm in front of this, a 2x2 inche frame has been created. This was screwed to the walls without plugs. The whole thin is a wobbly as hell. The plumber, when fixing the installation frame, tried to fix it to the wall and it simply pulled through the dot and dab. So he's screwed a bit of scrap timber to the lathe and then fixed to the installation frame to it. The whole thing is a total lashup!

I've taken the whole thing down and will construct something new tomorrow.....further delaying the tiling. I wouldn't mind but I'm paying for their time.

 

[doug boardley]

The plumber has been on site from 10:00 to about 17:00. Admittedly, the first couple of hours were spent with me sorting out the detail of where things were going and the implications for the tiling. However, in the remainder of the time, he tested a gas pipe which he installed that looked like it had been pierced by screws put up to secure the wet wall and fixed in the installation frames.

The wet saw is not very well constructed. A bit of lathe has been nailed to the wall. Then, about 200mmm in front of this, a 2x2 inche frame has been created. This was screwed to the walls without plugs. The whole thin is a wobbly as hell. The plumber, when fixing the installation frame, tried to fix it to the wall and it simply pulled through the dot and dab. So he's screwed a bit of scrap timber to the lathe and then fixed to the installation frame to it. The whole thing is a total lashup!

I've taken the whole thing down and will construct something new tomorrow.....further delaying the tiling. I wouldn't mind but I'm paying for their time.

???? care to elaborate PJ?

 

[Bathfix Bob]

I think PJ meant to say wet wall?

Who fitted this lash up?

 

[PJPro]

A mixture of people. I was supposed to do it but then the builders said they would knock something up. This was added to by the plumber and it all became rather weak. I'm going to try and make something more substantial tomorrow.

 

[PJPro]

OK. The wet wall is in. Previously the installation frames and the entire wet wall was hanging off a length of scrap lathe which had been nailed to the wall. The front was constructed out of 2x2 which has been screwed to the floor and walls....but straight into the concrete block (no plugs). The plumber had lashed things up further but to be fair to him he isn't there to build a wet wall. What did annoy me was that he didn't bother to put the bolts securing the installation frames in square....he angled them in (doubtless cos he used his power screwdriver) such that he had missed most of the timber and the screw was in fresh air. He couldn't even be bothered to get the tops of the frames at the same height and with these Geberit frames that takes two bolts!

I don't know about you, but I'd have been ashamed to show the client such soddy work. What annoyed me the most is I've spent quite a bit of money getting the best frames possible.....even buying a nice frame for the sink.....hoping that the builders would raise their game and do a really good job cos it's nice, even fun to install real quality items after the tat that most people seem to buy nowadays. Clearly, I was mistaken.

I spent a while taking the while thing down. I had to carefully ease the lathe away from the wall, using a hacksaw blade in a pad saw to cut the nails to avoid damaging the plaster board any more than I had necessary. Once the whole lot was off and chucked out the back garden.

I replaced the lathe with a length of 4x2. I used 7 10x140mm framing screws and plugs to secure the timber to the wall for form a support at the top and back of the wet wall. A similar length of of 4x2 was used at the bottom and front of the wall and secured with 6x120mm spax screws. All the strenght of the wall would come from these two pieces of timber. Two lengths of 4x2 was used for the ends at the front of the wall and secured using 4 10x140 framing screws and plugs. So far, so good.

I then installed the installation frames. Call me sad, but I found this fun! They are real quality items and the ease of installation and solid construction shows you where the money was spent. I then added 4x2s at 400 centres and at either side of the frames. These were braced against the 4x2 running along the back wall (the first bit of timber I installed) with 4x2 noggins. 4 inch spax screws were used throughout. I've ended up with a real strong, quality construction and something any of the guys on site could have put together with a little bit of care and the use of the right materials.

I think that anything you produce, be it something created with your hands or a piece of written work or whatever, really says something about the person you are. I always want to do a good job....or at least the best that I can. Casting my mind back to when I was a skilled labourer, there seemed to be a certain pride about doing a good job. Perhaps it was the people I worked along side. Perhaps it was because people were paid by the day rather than by the job. Perhaps it was because the boss would give you a hard time if the work you did was rubbish (as opposed to the know-nothing domestic client where any rework comes out of the boss' pocket). I just don't see that same pride in some of the guys we've had on site. It all been about doing the minimum rather than what's required (and this team are known for the exceptional work they do). Then again, perhaps I'm a dick.

The custom made stairs are being fitted on Monday. There's already been a ****-up when they were delivered with softwood rather than oak handrails and newel post caps. I predict another difficult discussion with the PM where he says that's what I asked for (except my wife was involved on the discussion this time and can back me up). Unless something has been signed in blood, it seems it gets forgotten, the cheap option is taken and I have to pay again to correct the mistakes of others. I just hope they can make a better job of installing the stairs....but I suspect it'll be screws without plugs and nails all over again.

Oh, and my wife bought the under floor heating stuff today. I'll fit it tomorrow and tile the floor. I went for Warmup loose wire from Topps.

Sorry for the rant.

 

[jay]

welcome to the tilers world as you have discovered not many other trades care as long as there works done thats all that matters they dont think of others

were as most tilers do might be the reason why this forum is so big good luck

rant anytime you wish we have all been there

jay

 

[Bathfix Bob]

I know what you mean PJ, very few tradesman seem to care about the quality of work, there are thousands of dodgy plumbers out there as well.
At least he probably wont be getting anymore work off you, nor will you recommend him if his work is'nt up to scratch.

I myself have been through about five Electricians this year, none of them did work to my usuall high standard, the last one I had complaints from the customer of sloppy work. They want to get done so fast the quality just isn't there.

Shame.

 

[brinkley]

pj i myself am renowned to doing my jobs over the top but i want to be happy thAt my clients are not going to be kiled by my lack of preparation get a decent sole trader in with a conscience quality and even politeness will be a lot better rant ove p s big companies dont care its not their fault IS IT

 

[PJPro]

We have a sad culture of do it cheap and throw it away.

I've been to a halloween party and am more than a little drunk. I so don't need a hangover tomorrow but felt the need to sink a few beers. I do have photos of progress thus far but, unfortunately, I don't have pictures of the lash up. I was so angry with it, I just wanted it out of my house.

 

[DHTiling]

You will get there in the end.. now sleep it off.

 

[PJPro]

Thanks Dave. No problem. I'll get there.

 

[DHTiling]

Was it a good night though..:lol:

 

[DHTiling]

What hi-fi..:lol:

What Hi-Fi? Sound and Vision - Where's PJPro gone - a tale of highs and woes