Just used 365 drills for the first time

[Gazzer]

Cornish Crofter,
Using the guide is only until you have made a groove for the bit to sit in, then you can take it away without the bit slipping.
As for your method of cutting square holes, it would take a long time to drill 4 holes and then remopve the centre, just use and angle grinder or the plunge method on a wet cutter....job done.

 

[Deleted member 1779]

Cornish in your last point (post 30) you ask if we sell guide plates only. I'm constantly looking at all options.

We did some pricing work with Screwfix when they wanted to look at us supplying guide plates only as a twin pack for £9.99RRP Each plate would have 5 sizes so the twin pack w$ould cater for ten seperate sizes. But that project is on ice for a moment.

The other thing retail are flagging is the price point of £49.99 is too much for joe public in the DIY sheds like B&Q and so the message is to break the kit.

They think instead of one kit at £49.99 it should be sold as two kits for £29.99 each. The thinking is to offer a fixtures and fitting kit (2x 6mm and 2x 8mm) and then another kit as a "service pipe" kit with 16mm 30mm and 40mm. So if Joe Public wants both kits then its £60 quid. Bottom line is if Mr Retailer with his big shed tells me he wants the split we will have to tow the line. But I am determined for online sales we will keep the BFKMX and its price of £49.99 and then just add the split packs as an addition to the range for retailers. It gives people choice (and keeping the BFKMX is £10 cheaper) I've never done retail before and I am having to bite my tounge and be told what to do!

 

[cornish_crofter]

To be fair I think the retailers may have a point with the £49.00 retail price. I don't like retailers in general as they so often push rubbish that they want to sell, rather than actually sell what people want :mad2:. So it actually pains me to agree with them rather than you , who actually sells what is needed.

If I was looking at this product in a retailer, I would be looking at what I actually need for my work. If it were Focus or B&Q etc and I was a DIYer I would be keen to buy what I felt I needed for my tiling jobs. The smaller bits are quite obvious, whereas most bathrooms still may not benefit from the larger bits. If I were a DIYer it probably wouldn't occurr to me that a 40mm bit would be of any use. DIYers may well drill and notch out a hole to fit, maybe using the smaller bits to help.

...but those are just my thoughts. From your point of view the retailers are simply trying to maximise their (and your) sales, so they're really working for you.

 

[pt44]

I have to agree with the spit idea. I know you are trying to keep the price of the main kit low - and by all means keep selling it online. However, a kit that does the main 2 sizes - the 6mm and 8mm - which covers the most used raw plugs is a great idea. And for a DIY'er, if I rarely needed to cut a large size hole, I wouldn't be tempted to buy a large bit. I'd be much more tempted to get the 6 & 8 and cut lots of small holes instead. As almost certainly the hole will have something over the top which will cover the rough edge.

I've just been using the 6 and 8 all week - and they are truly superb. Well pleased with the whole kit still.

As for the guide - its cheap and plastic - but works fine. I'd consider buying a second one if this one wears out - however, at £5 for one - I'd rather drill a few holes in a piece of wood or plastic and just make it myself. Its not like the guide is doing anything hard. Its just holding the drill in place until a groove is formed - and it forms a groove pretty damn quickly.

Paul

 

[cornish_crofter]

Richard

Just used mine for the first time in cheap ceramic.

Due to my need to fit a tile over existing power and water supply for an electric shower, I had to drill the tile before I put it up. To achieve this I bathed it in water then started with the drill guide. Once I cut the groove I removed said drill giude as suggested.

However it may be worth suggesting the tile is immersed in a cat litter tray or similar with about 1/2" of water in, if it is being drilled before being laid.

Also, whilst drilling, an idea came to me......

Would it be feasable to house a little resevoir of water inside the diamond drill bit? The centripetal force of the drill could then be utilised to expel the water to aid drilling.

I suspect this could be done quite cheaply. A high absorbancy material inside the bit could store the water, and would shed it when the bit is rotated as speed.

You would refill simply by imersing the bit (not the drill) in water.

I don't know if you've already looked at this Richard but it may be worth a thought.

To a certain extend this worked with the 8mm bit. The muck inside did retain a little water so it wasn't going on 100% dry.

 

[DHTiling]

Just push a piece of wet sponge inside the drill bit and HEY!! presto instant water feed.....A tip mentioned on here before...

 

[cornish_crofter]

I'll try that.

 

[Deleted member 1779]

Funny enough this came up the other week with Nigel Stokes - the MD of Arctic. Their team were suggesting we add sponges inside the drills to hold water.

They were saying basically - the lack of a water delivery system is a tricky topic for their salesmen to convince the big boys to look at this kit because every other alternative out there has provided a method to tackle water.

At that time I said they were over-engineering the solution and adding things to the kit and it would take away its simplicity.

I do understand what you are saying and it would mean integrating it into the system. The big sizes could take the fitting of a sponge. But its those sizes that are relatively stable with wear and tear.

The smaller sizes (6mm and 8mm) are too small to have sponges fitted but its that end of the drilling where stability is most difficult to control. At the moment I am talking to my diamond supplier about a stronger version of diamond for smaller sizes. But I will take on the water suggestion. One thing I do know is that we have to be ahead of the completion and re-invention (like washing detergents) is a must for products to survive. Its also help and input from you guys - the end users that keep us smart!

PS: Slightly off topic but the marketing guru's came up with this slogan which is now on the website:

New ideas dont have to be expensive, just creative and effective.

Dealing with a recession demands greater creativity from companies and those who sustain innovation will survive and often thrive as new opportunities open up.
Come on B&Q - Read the bloody message!

 

[cornish_crofter]

I was just thinking of what you could easily integrate into the existing design.

The smaller sizes could have sponges on the outside. Again, charged by dipping the whole bit into water. Whether this would work or simply soak the surrounding area with the centripetal force I don't know, you would need to spend some R&D with that one.

Also, another idea I had whilst using the guide, could you not incorporate suction cups to prevent us having to hold it? I know some people tape it into position but with water around it isn't the best solution.

Or maybe, you could develop a more robust guide that can be used for the whole hole, with an integrated water delivery system. By that I mean holes around the gude hole that expel water when you put pressure on the guide.

 

[DHTiling]

Suction cups only work on smooth tiles and not a riven finish...:mad2: