Major Problem!!!

[Tedd]

He is not happy with everything and don't think replacing the cracked tiles is an option as the indepandant expert has advised the following:

All tiles to be removed to living and dinng room (£2500 of granite) floor to be pulled up by joiner.
Building contratcer to replace all joists
25mm Marine ply to be installed on joists
Retiled

Therefore the joiner gets away with buying several sheets of ply and laying them while I am left with a bill for over £3500 in tile adhesive and labour.

 

[Mike]

if the independant expert has said the substrate is the problem and you never prepared it i don't see how you'll be liable. i blame the joiner.

 

[Mike]

and i think you mean in post 24 12mm deviation not deflection. the floor should be deflection free.

 

[CJ]

You have to prepare yourself for a battle, as the joiner will be laying the blame soley with you...............

He never prepared the floor to BS standards in anyway, shape or form.

Who contracted you to do the work............Joiner or customer?

 

[Mike]

if it was your fault only the tiles would need to be lifted. they're admitting the substrate was at fault by replacing/strengthening it therfore the joiner (who prepared it) is at fault i.m.o.

 

[Aston]

He is not happy with everything and don't think replacing the cracked tiles is an option as the indepandant expert has advised the following:

All tiles to be removed to living and dinng room (£2500 of granite) floor to be pulled up by joiner.
Building contratcer to replace all joists
25mm Marine ply to be installed on joists
Retiled

Therefore the joiner gets away with buying several sheets of ply and laying them while I am left with a bill for over £3500 in tile adhesive and labour.

thats not true tedd,
your shouldnt have to foot the bill for the re tiling, if the initial problem wasnt caused by your negligence
if the reason the cracks appeared were due to the a structural fault, then thats the responsibilty off the contractor.
you really should contact a solicitor asap..you need to know your legal rights and responsibilites regarding this matter.

 

[Tedd]

The Joiner seemed to be project managing the job and initially hired us. He was organising all the tradesman plasterers, plumbers, electrician etc although the owner has now said he was project managing it although we never saw him. The joiner had to sign off the tiling with the owner before we were paid and we were paid in full.

The customer ias actually bieng ok and has said that it has to go to court because there are 2 parties involved and the joiner is not admitting any liability whatsoever as he is convinced he layed the floor to BS.

Where can I get a copy of BS?

 

[TrumpersUnited]

I would just offer FOC labour to put the job right accepting no liability if i were you Tedd.

 

[CJ]

So did the joiner pay you...........or customer direct?

I bet the joiner is getting worried as well

 

[Mike]

I would just offer FOC labour to put the job right accepting no liability if i were you Tedd.

although that would be a nice gesture it may be seen to some as an admittance to blame, and why should you be out of pocket due to someone elses mistake

 

[Tabby Cranks]

The joiner has said in the investigation that there was a 12-14mm deflection in the floor prior to tiling but this is well within BS according to him. We had to fill part of it with self levelling compound to give us a chance to get over it.

I can't get my head around this. Was the floor deflecting (bouncing) 12-14mm? If so how would a leveling compound over come this? Or are you saying there was a 12-14mm fall or dip?

 

[jay]

and i think you mean in post 24 12mm deviation not deflection. the floor should be deflection free.

must agree its a bit confusing

 

[charlie1]

yeah, that would be very bouncy!

 

[floora]

Sure its movement and not shrinkage of the ply?

 

[mapei242]

I agree must be deviation, however with regard to deflection of a timber floor. If your floor is suitable for a tigger (not necessarily a technical term) then this is not suitable for tile application. The adhesives have have extreme defomability capabilities these days with S2 category but there still lies the underlying problem that tiles do not bend!

A floor must be solid and sound of strength no matter what its construction.

 

[jay]

could be messy but back to basics .What caused the floor to fail,
Not the actual tiling but the substrate

 

[Tedd]

Hi Everyone,

Been away so sorry for no response. It was a 12 - 14mm dip there did not seem to be any movement in the floor prior to tiling.

 

[CJ]

Why was it dipping at all??

 

[Tedd]

I thought it was just the age of the property, It did it in several places but no movement was felt, even with 4 of us on the floor.

 

[Stephen@Weber]

So the tiles are still stuck down but are cracking? You can't of stuck them down that badly! How thick was your adhesive bed?

 

[DHTiling]

I thought it was just the age of the property, It did it in several places but no movement was felt, even with 4 of us on the floor.

If you are getting cracks then it is deffo a form of stress.. be it deflection or expansion/contraction..

 

[Tedd]

Here are 2 photos, one of the cracking along the ply and the other were there was insufficient adhesive in the top right corner.

 

[DHTiling]

Yep.. looks like stress at the ply joints and insufficient bedding of the tiles..

 

[Tedd]

There was a full bed of adhesive under where the crack was though. It was stuck fast it was one corner that had insufficient adhesive

 

[DHTiling]

The adhesive bed is still ribbed.. so no it wasn't a solid bed.. but ye you can see that stress crack right through the adhesive ribs