fast tiling

[CJ]

Quality not quantity comes first.........then the longer you have been doing it.....the faster you should get, but not so fast that your quality suffers. We all have had jobs where the substrate has been perfect, and you could almost throw the tiles and they land spot on.......but those jobs are few and far between.

The older we all get, the slower we become.

Why rush anything.

 

[The D]

Couldnt agree more Doug.


My issue Deano was that you were quoting "my" work ethics, replying to "my" posts and being openly proud of causing upset.


I now understand that the underlying issue WAS with others (I think). I never slated fast tiling, but added some tongue in cheek humour to lighten the atmosphere. Even this got flipped around to try to start an argument. I have now read through the entire "DIY bathroom" thread which created this monster. In there
Deano you are partial to "mocking" Ash about his speed, but he took it as a joke (which I assume you meant it to be).........





Sadly it is one of those threads which was clearly created to end this way. As @Bri said posting of this nature is tantamount to trolling and @AliGage thankyou for shedding some light on how this thread has come to be in existence....I think it may have been your "yeeeeeeah" comment that started it.


I love a good discussion as much as the next tiler, but WILL stand up for myself and others when directly targeted Deano. You stated how much you get the hump when slow tilers slate fast tilers yet you refuse to acknowledge that people take offence at you slating how slow they are. To me arrogance really is a repulsive character trait.


If you haven't got a sound basis for your argument, then don't enter into one. In order for any argument to be valid the conclusion must follow logically from the basis and it has to be a non-fallacious logical form.....the exact opposite of your approach.

The arroganc of people is why I started this thread. Why is it whenever someone mentions they tile x amount in x time people feel the need to say they may be slower but it is because the put more in to it than the one going faster than them ??
I have a valid point and I do not start something if I think I am wrong.
yes I have poked fun at ash and I have always told him the truth about what I think but it was not ash that was Bering questions was it. The tiler that ash is working for is doing a job on site and that is a lot different to domestic tiling. Ash said his gaffer did 33m2 in a day and the very next post was a negative post about back buttering then there was a post mor or less calling him a liar and a nother comment about getting hurt from the tiles as they are thrown down.
IMO it is theads like that one that are the bad ones on this forum there was no need for it and it was someone eylses tread.

 

[Spud]

so here is what I did yesterday and today , tiles were already on site the floor was scraped, hoovered , primed and ditra matted the day before , about 75m2 tiled by me and another lad all tiles were back spread and the floor was bedded out with adhesive where needed . started at 9 am finished at 4 the first day started at 8.30am and finished at 5pm this evening and also latexed a small 10m2 utility floor as well , nothing special we didnt rush just worked at a normal pace left the place clean and tidy and put all our waste in the skip. I know tilers like PJC has guys that knock out 60m2 plus a day on their own to a fair standard on shop floors and do this day in and day out

 

[TJ Smiler]

Looks great mate, 2 days is bloody good. I really have to find someone to work with more often, i do 99% of jobs on my own and a floor like that would prob take me about 5 days 'odd'. Not so sure it's working out cost effective for me to keep doing it on my own, yeah i get a bigger lump of money but it is so much graft on your todd, all the washing, tidying, mixing etc takes up so much time. Trying to find a laborer is bloody difficult though.............

If you get anything you want a hand on mate gis a bell if your normal fellers aint available, i'm in Broxborne (hertford) so only down the 414.

 

[Spud]

Looks great mate, 2 days is bloody good. I really have to find someone to work with more often, i do 99% of jobs on my own and a floor like that would prob take me about 5 days 'odd'. Not so sure it's working out cost effective for me to keep doing it on my own, yeah i get a bigger lump of money but it is so much graft on your todd, all the washing, tidying, mixing etc takes up so much time. Trying to find a laborer is bloody difficult though.............

If you get anything you want a hand on mate gis a bell if your normal fellers aint available, i'm in Broxborne (hertford) so only down the 414.

PM sent

 

[Martyn Leeds]

Spot-on,

I wish and hope that I'll get to the point where I can easily knock-out 20-30m a day.

The thing I don't get is how its possible to get every single tile fitted. Right upto the corners, doorways, last bits at the end of a run, and its all dry enough to walk on, kneel on to reach out to put the last cuts in??

I had to spread a 4m bathroom floor over 2 days at the weekend, it was impossible to get 2 cuts in, so it was either sit around for 2-3 hrs to wait for it to dry (on a Sunday aft), or pack-up and come back the next day..

 

[jonnyc]

Spot-on,

I wish and hope that I'll get to the point where I can easily knock-out 20-30m a day.

The thing I don't get is how its possible to get every single tile fitted. Right upto the corners, doorways, last bits at the end of a run, and its all dry enough to walk on, kneel on to reach out to put the last cuts in??

I had to spread a 4m bathroom floor over 2 days at the weekend, it was impossible to get 2 cuts in, so it was either sit around for 2-3 hrs to wait for it to dry (on a Sunday aft), or pack-up and come back the next day..

welltheres the thing martyn.
it all comes together with experience but certainly possible

 

[Andy Allen]

Spot-on,

I wish and hope that I'll get to the point where I can easily knock-out 20-30m a day.

The thing I don't get is how its possible to get every single tile fitted. Right upto the corners, doorways, last bits at the end of a run, and its all dry enough to walk on, kneel on to reach out to put the last cuts in??

I had to spread a 4m bathroom floor over 2 days at the weekend, it was impossible to get 2 cuts in, so it was either sit around for 2-3 hrs to wait for it to dry (on a Sunday aft), or pack-up and come back the next day..

I dry cut it all first then stick them down starting with the ones you wont be able to reach..

 

[TJ Smiler]

Spot-on,

I wish and hope that I'll get to the point where I can easily knock-out 20-30m a day.

The thing I don't get is how its possible to get every single tile fitted. Right upto the corners, doorways, last bits at the end of a run, and its all dry enough to walk on, kneel on to reach out to put the last cuts in??

I had to spread a 4m bathroom floor over 2 days at the weekend, it was impossible to get 2 cuts in, so it was either sit around for 2-3 hrs to wait for it to dry (on a Sunday aft), or pack-up and come back the next day..

For me mate (and i aint near as fast as some of these fellers) i always try as best i can and heights etc permitting tile level so i'm gonna be tiling into corners etc i'll snap a few chalk lines and then work from the corners back to my last line and because i work to 'plumb' i already no what level i gotta keep my tiles at so the meet perfectly......... hope that makes sense?

 

[The D]

so here is what I did yesterday and today , tiles were already on site the floor was scraped, hoovered , primed and ditra matted the day before , about 75m2 tiled by me and another lad all tiles were back spread and the floor was bedded out with adhesive where needed . started at 9 am finished at 4 the first day started at 8.30am and finished at 5pm this evening and also latexed a small 10m2 utility floor as well , nothing special we didnt rush just worked at a normal pace left the place clean and tidy and put all our waste in the skip. I know tilers like PJC has guys that knock out 60m2 plus a day on their own to a fair standard on shop floors and do this day in and day out

that looks like a real good job m8 and done in quick time ;0)

 

[The D]

Just out of interest Gary how would you feel if you found out that on another forum or down the pub there was a couple of domestic bathroom bashers that had never met you and never seen your work and new nothing about you except the fact you did 75m2 in two days and they was basically saying you must be cutting corners or lieing about how much you had done.

I have just read this back and answered my own question I would feel sory for them. So I apologise for trying to make you see just how bloody rud you are as it is purely down to the ignarence of what is possible in the trade from a real tiler.

 

[m3fitter]

OK i was reading a thread and was quite surprised at the attitude of some of the members when it comes to tilers that can get the m2 done quick time. the comments came thick and fast "if it was done that quick it must have been done wrong as in not back skimmed or it must be rough or a lie". now I'm not one to start an argument and i know that fast does not automatically mean good. but it does not automatically mean bad. and i know it is hard for some to conceive that a tiler can fix more than five m2 per day without it being complete rubbish but believe it or not some of us can. and to be honest slow is no guarantee of quality either. i will post some pics tomorrow of a floor i did today 36m2 kitchen, dining room, broom cupboard, hall, cupboard under the stairs, and cloak room. on to a power floated floor using 600 by 300 Eagle polished porcelain.


but for now here is one from the other day not exactly high end but not minging either
View attachment 58889 View attachment 58890 View attachment 58891 View attachment 58892 View attachment 58893

Agree totally, arrrr but the next day... hmmmm its taken its toll !! lol

 

[jonnyc]

understand the first paragraph but not the second.

 

[m3fitter]

speed doesn't necessarily mean bad quality, I can tile 35 metres on my own on a good day, and sometimes only 12... the speed can reflect how good the substrate is... i'm finding that 800x800 porcs fly down, quicker than 600x600, yet 600x300 rectified halfbond is slowwwwww, or chamfered edge 300x300 old style floors really fly down, tiling on Anhydrate flies down...... Saturday morning tiling as a rule does not fly down ! lol

 

[Qwerty]

understand the first paragraph but not the second.

Likewise

 

[Spud]

Just out of interest Gary how would you feel if you found out that on another forum or down the pub there was a couple of domestic bathroom bashers that had never met you and never seen your work and new nothing about you except the fact you did 75m2 in two days and they was basically saying you must be cutting corners or lieing about how much you had done.

I have just read this back and answered my own question I would feel sory for them. So I apologise for trying to make you see just how bloody rud you are as it is purely down to the ignarence of what is possible in the trade from a real tiler.[/QUOTE) not too worried about what other tilers say as all tilers are a bit on the bitchy side it starts as soon as you start to learn and walk into every pub and restaurant and critique the standard of the tiling .in Germany they have a tariff book everything is set out by time and motion studies ceramic floor tiling tiled and grouted is one sq metre per hour wall tiling 1.1 hours they have pretty much broken down all the items I wonder if Rainsco could publish the tariffs for us to have a look at then you could honestly say if you are faster or slower than tariff

 

[TJ Smiler]

in Germany they have a tariff book everything is set out by time and motion studies ceramic floor tiling tiled and grouted is one sq metre per hour wall tiling 1.1 hours they have pretty much broken down all the items I wonder if Rainsco could publish the tariffs for us to have a look at then you could honestly say if you are faster or slower than tariff[/QUOTE]

How interesting, look forward to reading more from Rainsco

 

[peteablard]

I wasn't sure why this thread was started then did a bit of digging and found the other thread that sparked it and to be fair there were a few comments aimed at Ash that were uncalled for. I've fixed and grouted 60m2 in a shift single handed several times doing car showrooms. I've laid over 40m2 of ditra and tiled it in a day on my own. Why would any of us lie or exaggerate what we are capable of or what we've seen people do? I've also been part of a 3 man team that struggled to fix 10m2 between us in a day!! If everything goes well and you're the type of person who gets their head down and cracks on with it then it 30+ metres a day is easy in the right circumstances.
I've met Dean and I know he can argue with the best of them (No offence meant pal) However I genuinely believe this thread was started with the intention of proving a valid point and not to fall out with people.

 

[Peter]

Every job is so different with substrate flatness, tiles, checks etc its hard to have a consistent daily meterage. Took me 5 days to do a 30m bathroom lately due to lots of boxing reveals etc and 14 lengths or chrome trim. Straight walls and one window would have it done in 2 days. Could be done in a day on an open floor.

 

[m3fitter]

in the early 90's, a tiler was known by his speed ( as it was p**s easy then to be honest, with chamfered edge small tiles ! ) these days, with rectified edges and large format, its a challenge to get meterage down, as there's no hiding behind magic grout ! lol ;-)

 

[Saltire69]

I cannot believe that this has escalated into such a bitchfest.
I suppose in a way i started this. I did have a motive and there IS and underlying reason behind my comments.
Ridiculed for Ash and (cant be bothered going looking for the post but.... ) his gaffer knocking out 38m, they werent. I dont think anyone was "ridiculed" in that post.
We all complain about builders, cowboys etc etc. Ash has been tiling for all of 5 minutes. Are we suggesting that he should be able to knock that sort of coverage out in a day? If he does then do we think that he has the experience to apply both speed and accuracy to his work? I would argue no. And thats not just because its Ash.

Its almost comical that the same people that would complain about course tilers are supporting "bash it out" attitude to someone that isnt even a course tiler. Its nothing short of ludicrous in my opinion. Care, finesse and attention to detail are all vitally important traits i feel in our industry. Traits that should take presidence over speed and profit.
Yes a tiler of some 30 years can probably get it done. I personally hate working when i feel rushed. Believe it or not i like my job and trade and this will continue to be the case all the while i apply my own attitude towards my work and continue to enjoy it.

So ill ask the question. 38sqm fixed in a day. Is this something that a tiler at apprentice level should be achieving? Or aiming towards? Is quantity at this level more important than quality?

On a personal level i wouldnt know if i could cover that floor in the same time frame Deano has. To be completely honest it doesnt look very complex in layout. Nothing too awkward to navigate. But id sooner not. I mean what would you charge then? £20psm? So were saying £700+ per day!? I couldnt justify that to a customer. Maybe speedy residential work like that might encourage cheaper pricing. We've all complained about that havent we? Couple cheap pricing and inexeperience together do we not get the other bug bear? Poor finish. Cowboy builders blah blah blah.

If you think about it in a way youre shooting yourselves in both feet.

If you can do it with experience then thats fannastic. Without complaint, awesome!
Setting the bar there for apprentice tilers is nothing short of industry destruction and stupid. IMO

Their paying Deano for his expertise, Whats the difference between another tiler charging the same but taking 3.5 days to do it. The client still pays the same.

 

[m3fitter]

yes, time that it takes is irrelevant, if... done correctly without fault,
one the otherhand, one of my tilers, asked for a job on price... foolishly I agreed, he tiled 17 on the wall on 6 on the floor, grouted in a bathroom in one day, from 7.30am - 10pm ! metro 300x100 halfbond wall, 600x300 rectified halfbond on floor... !
they wanted to go to bed ! the next day they looked at everything, picking up slightly recessed grout in places, mitred trim not meeting perfectly etc,etc....
if he had taken 2 days to complete, I am sure that they would not have snagged the work, as it was passable, not perfect, but passable and maybe just a quick re visit..
they stated ' working from 7.30 - 10pm, he must have been tired, why did he work this late '
so in essence, if you can tile large meterage and they are happy with the end result.. all good but if it looks a lot for one day, they will scrutinize

 

[Dougs Third Go]

okay, an analogy, my van needs fixing, say for instance drive shaft has gone, I ring round garages workshops etc to get a price/ quote, one of the first questions I ask is "how long will it take?" If I get 3 similar quotes monetary wise and the choice is ; a) 3 days, b) 2 days, c) 1 day.....all done to same spec, which quote am I gonna take?

 

[Chalker]

Speed is gained by experience and age. (To a point)

you don't get faster, you get more efficient,

 

[widler]

Im up glasgow a week on monday , gotta tile this,90m2 , bet it takes me more than a day !
" don't worry wid its flat as a pancake and bang on ready to go"

Head in hands and crying me eyes out .

Ps i totally agree about pricing, we are paid for our skills, if we wanted to get paid by the hour we would be stacking shelves .
It should not matter how fast we work as long as the works right, unfortunately how many have heard a customer say " christ i wish i was on your rate "