Scotland to be independent or not?

[user123]

Wow, interesting reading. I don't understand enough about the difference independence would make in real terms to the Scottish people, but I have HUGE respect for the Scottish abilities, I have many friends up there, and all of them, without fail, are smart, quick, very realistic and very positive. The educational system used to be and still might be loads better than the English one, there is a higher standard of education in general. If the Scottish want independence, I think they can do whatever they like and succeed, the grit is there.

BUT, why is no-one, as far as I can tell, wondering why it has come to this point? Personally I feel it has more to do with the point Dan made, politics made in London firmly favouring the South, I'm quite sure if the North of England had the choice of indepence they would have gone for it ages ago. When H and I were teaching up near Edinburgh a few years back there was a group of middle aged women having a coffee morning at the same community centre, and as I went in the kitchen to set up tea etc for our lunch break I overheard them talk, these 15 or so women, and I was blown away with respect. They were handling these cakes and sandwhiches and all the while were talking about finance, about best investment options, interest rates, the pros and cons of buying property, I felt I had walked into some sort of financiers symposium.

I asked one of them who they were, and the reply was just a bunch of housewifes and retired women who meet up once a fortnight. There was no moaning, no blaming the government, just an attitude, this is where we are, what can we do to improve our lot. They made me proud to be a woman, and boy did I understand why our Scottish club teachers are so active up there, so organised, very hands on. Don't underestimate the Scots, me thinks, great folk.

 

[kendo1]

As the Australian said...
"Fight and you may die. Run and you will live at least awhile. And dying in your bed many years from now, would you be willing to trade all the days from this day to that for one chance, just one chance, to come back here as young men and tell our enemies that they may take our lives but they will never take our freedom!”

 

[user123]

As the Australian said...
"Fight and you may die. Run and you will live at least awhile. And dying in your bed many years from now, would you be willing to trade all the days from this day to that for one chance, just one chance, to come back here as young men and tell our enemies that they may take our lives but they will never take our freedom!”

Aah, freedom, Ken... the essence of which is a whole other kettle of fish though, isn't it? Freedom, the real sense of freedom, can only come from within the individual after all. Will the Scottish folk feel freer with independence or just smaller, restricted? That will depend on the individual's attitude to life and to how much power any government should really have over daily attitudes. And when you look at daily attitudes that in the end make up our quality of life, governments, in the (more or less) democratic West, have very little to do with that.

 

[Gall.B]

Great post Gisela as usual very well put.

There are perhaps many reasons its got to this point, as mentioned Scotland is or should be rich, our culture language indiginous people where all but wiped out by the Empire (as of yet no apology) We are always the last when the cream is shared out (even behin the North of England) and have no voice in Europe or Internationaly, our country is a nuclear dumping ground, no control over our own affairs and I think people have genuinely had enough of sending its young to the front line of ilegal wars.

Your right we are a proud folk with true grit and will not stand for any less than we deservre, that seems to be sinking in with Mr C judging by the whistle stop tour porridge eating and nervous interview I just watched on the local news a diffrent Tory attitude from 15yrs ago.

 

[kendo1]

I'm just putting the cat among the pigeons.

 

[hillhead]

There's a lot of people over this side of the sea not happy about this, Scotland seeking independence from the union.. tut tut.lol.

 

[kendo1]

An Englishman and a Scotsman are driving head on, at night, on a twisty, dark road. Both are driving too fast for the conditions and collide on a sharp bend in the road. To the amazement of both, they are unscathed, though their cars are both destroyed. In celebration of their luck, both agree to put aside their dislike for the other from that moment on. At this point, the Scotsman goes to the boot and fetches a 12 year old bottle of whisky. He hands the bottle to the Englishman, whom exclaims,
"May the Scots and the English live together forever, in peace, and harmony." The Englishman then tips the bottle and gulps half of the bottle down. Still flabbergasted over the whole thing, he goes to hand the bottle back to the Scotsman, who replies,
"No, thanks, I'll just wait till the Police get here."

 

[user123]

haha, that's a twist of the man/woman driver joke.. :lol:

 

[Gall.B]

There's a lot of people over this side of the sea not happy about this, Scotland seeking independence from the union.. tut tut.lol.

My ancestors on my Grandfathers side escaped the British on the Emerald isle at the height of the great famine maybe thats why im such a rebel :smilewinkgrin:

My Maw's side are of Gaelic desent and its been a great shame the lack of investment and effort in our history and culture in our curiculuim in the past but in recent years much more has been done to preserve restore our culture. We where taught virtually nothing about who we where in School mocked for accents, you would go home asking your folks why we spoke wrong and my teacher says thats not a word, very confusing for a wee person. Now I feel imensley proud of my roots and heritage as well I should :lol:

 

[kendo1]

Edward Longshanks comes to Scotland to Conquer the Scots. He brings 4,000 men with him. As he nears the battlefield, there suddenly appears a solitary figure on the crest of the hill - a short, ginger-haired guy in a kilt.

'Hammer O the Scots!' yells the wee Scottish guy on the hill. 'Come up here, ya English *******s, and I'll give ye a hammerin'!'

Edward turns to his commander. 'Send 20 men to deal with that little Scottish upstart,' he says. The commander sends twenty of his best men over the hill to kill the Scotsman.

Ten minutes later, at the crest of the hill, The little Scot appears again. 'Ya English diddies!' he yells. 'Come on the rest of ye!Come on, I'll have ye all!'

Edward is getting somewhat annoyed. He turns to his commander. 'Send 100 men to kill that little guttersnipe!' The commander sends 100 men over the hill to do the job.

Ten minutes later, the little Scot appears at the top of the hill once more, his hair all sticking up, his shirt a wee bit torn. 'Ya English SCUM!' he yells. 'I'm just warming up! Come and get me, ya English scum!'

Edward loses patience. 'Commander, take 400 men and personally destroy him!' he yells. The commander gulps, but leads four hundred men on horseback over the crest of the hill.

Ten minutes later, the little Scotsman is back. His clothing is all torn, his face is covered in blood. 'Is that the best ye can do? You're bloody wimmin! Come on! Come and have a go ya bunch of English scum!!' he yells.

Edward turns to his second in command. 'Take 1,000 men over that hill and don't come back till you've killed him!' he commands. The second in command gathers the men and they ride off over the hill to their fate.

Ten minutes later, one of the English troops appears back at the top of the hill. He's covered in blood and his clothes are all torn. 'Your Majesty!' he yells. 'It's a trap! There's two of them!

 

[Gall.B]

[video=youtube_share;IlDijR0Y60Q]http://youtu.be/IlDijR0Y60Q[/video]

 

[Gall.B]

Edward Longshanks comes to Scotland to Conquer the Scots. He brings 4,000 men with him. As he nears the battlefield, there suddenly appears a solitary figure on the crest of the hill - a short, ginger-haired guy in a kilt.

'Hammer O the Scots!' yells the wee Scottish guy on the hill. 'Come up here, ya English *******s, and I'll give ye a hammerin'!'

Edward turns to his commander. 'Send 20 men to deal with that little Scottish upstart,' he says. The commander sends twenty of his best men over the hill to kill the Scotsman.

Ten minutes later, at the crest of the hill, The little Scot appears again. 'Ya English diddies!' he yells. 'Come on the rest of ye!Come on, I'll have ye all!'

Edward is getting somewhat annoyed. He turns to his commander. 'Send 100 men to kill that little guttersnipe!' The commander sends 100 men over the hill to do the job.

Ten minutes later, the little Scot appears at the top of the hill once more, his hair all sticking up, his shirt a wee bit torn. 'Ya English SCUM!' he yells. 'I'm just warming up! Come and get me, ya English scum!'

Edward loses patience. 'Commander, take 400 men and personally destroy him!' he yells. The commander gulps, but leads four hundred men on horseback over the crest of the hill.

Ten minutes later, the little Scotsman is back. His clothing is all torn, his face is covered in blood. 'Is that the best ye can do? You're bloody wimmin! Come on! Come and have a go ya bunch of English scum!!' he yells.

Edward turns to his second in command. 'Take 1,000 men over that hill and don't come back till you've killed him!' he commands. The second in command gathers the men and they ride off over the hill to their fate.

Ten minutes later, one of the English troops appears back at the top of the hill. He's covered in blood and his clothes are all torn. 'Your Majesty!' he yells. 'It's a trap! There's two of them!

Thats a true story! :lol:

 

[user123]

@Ken... :lol:

 

[user123]

[video=youtube_share;IlDijR0Y60Q]http://youtu.be/IlDijR0Y60Q[/video]

Just wondering, is there any light hearted Scottish folk music or is it traditionally all sort of heavy and tragic? I like the sound and the 'realness' of the music, but the words always seem just so serious! Wrong impression? Or not?

 

[Stewart]

As oil seems to be the crux of most independent wannabe's arguments for independence, could you please tell me (as I can't find any) which so called oil rich countries actually benefit from being oil rich, as all the one's I know of only benefit the few and not the masses......?


Created on iPhone.....

 

[Gall.B]

As oil seems to be the crux of most independent wannabe's arguments for independence, could you please tell me (as I can't find any) which so called oil rich countries actually benefit from being oil rich, as all the one's I know of only benefit the few and not the masses......?


Created on iPhone.....

Its certainly not the crux of my argument or anybody elses I know, Where theres oil theres the Americans so perhaps ask them?

That being said Norway seem to do extremly well from theres and it shows in the standard of living health, prosperity and hapiness of the population all that and no need to be part of the EU :yikes:

Wanabees? if thats your attitude towards Scottish folk and there patriotisim, well im sorry it smacks of arrogance and is very patronising, just hope the torys and the rest keep that approach up as it aint doing them any favours!

 

[Gall.B]

[video=youtube_share;8vjzTSDqn90]http://youtu.be/8vjzTSDqn90[/video]

More light hearted just for you Gisela, humor is something we are good at :lol:

 

[user123]

Now I fancy a donut... thanks! :lol: but Stu - arrogant? NO way... not in a million years.

 

[Gall.B]

I apologise if took in wrong context, one thing im not is a wanabee in any department nor is my country or fellow countrymen, for either having a diffrence of opinion or the gumption or to go it alone without an overlord goverment (back to being serious now :lol


[video=youtube_share;SguYlpm3ffQ]http://youtu.be/SguYlpm3ffQ[/video]

HUMOROUS AGAIN!

 

[kilty55]

really good thread this with some passionate voices,i have no doubt scotland could hold its own,there are much smaller countrues with less resources available to them that have managed quite fine.

how will it work.will the armed forces disband and re structure? the nhs etc etc all these will have to be re structured there is so much to look into and think about as its such a big move....england wont want to have to do all this im sure either which is no doubt one of the many reasons cameron wants to keep the union.

2014 and 2016 i have read both mentioned to go ahead with this........is this the time to be breaking the uk up...right in the middle of a worldwide recession? is it sensible to expect both new countries to build and flourish under these circumstances? and it will cost a vast amount fo money to restructure both sides i would imagine...imo i dont think the timing is right

also the uk is a respected force in the world and a safe place especially considering the current volatile stuff thats going on around the world...where do we stand in strength if that comes knocking at our door?

i am very patriotic,but i think it would weaken both countries by splitting ,i think england needs us and we also need them same goes with the welsh and irish

we all have our roots that will never change in our hearts,but just now i think we need each other and i see no reason that will benefit anyone by splitting

we actually already have great health facilities,education up here infact some claim its better than south of the border

i have lived in north england and south england and have seen the difference in money/opportunities in some of these areas......we shouldnt look up on ourselves as hard done by we have many opportunities up here just as many as living in englandshire .

 

[Andy Allen]

im all for it, think of all the out of work brickies in england, that could be employed rebuilding hadrian's wall....:lol:

 

[Perry]

im all for it, think of all the out of work brickies in england, that could be employed rebuilding hadrian's wall....:lol:

Andy could we do it in brick slips please :mad2: