Tiler has made mistakes - Advice required

[Andy Allen]

Wow just read all this, the man come on for some advice,what on some of you like the tiling was not that good, bad setting out and tiled over paint as well, and you lot are sticking up for the tiler, talk about bloody double standards from some of you.
My advice tony, dont listen, its your house ,if you are not happy don't pay him,if the 'tiler' is happy then he knows its a crap job, simple

think you need to read it again...

has bathroom tiled, happy with it, then changes mind, not happy with it, still lets tiler start next bathroom, without paying for the first bathroom, that he's happy with, or maybe not, your guess is as good as mine, most folks would of stopped him half way through the first bathroom, anyway starts 2nd bathroom with a few issues (yes we all agree with that..) can be sorted , lots of advice have been given for this.

decides to stop him working to disscuss issues, comes on here for a moan, decides he aint happy with 1st and 2nd bathroom, wants him to finish the 2nd bathroom, so he can install the rest of the bathroom suite, then he may change it at some point, all of this without paying ANYTHING to the tiler....

and you think thats fair..??

 

[AliGage]

Agree with Andy, there are two sides to this and i'm sure a lot more information we are not hearing. Besides which we haven't heard the opinion of the tiler either.

I don't believe the tiler should not be paid for his time, certainly if the customer is leaving the bathrooms as they've been tiled/finished etc. But from the sounds of it the tiler admits he has made some errrors as well.

A middle ground needs to be found. I would agree the tiler perhaps should not recieve his full ammount for his efforts if he has made errors that the customer is not happy with. But if these errors are still accepted and the tiles left in situe then he deserves to be paid something. If the errors are something that the customer can't live with (don't believe from the sounds of it that is the case here) then the customer and the tiler needs to discuss a resolution where both parties are happy.

 

[Andy Allen]

spot on alli...

 

[widler]

maybe the bloke is being a bit harsh,maybe not,its his house,his his money.
have you never been to a job looked at then thought,that looks a good job(if you don't know what your looking at)been somewhere else and seen the same but looks a hell of a lot better or been back a few days later and thought that looks crap,this sounds like what this bloke has done.
maybe he has to keep the other bathroom because he has too,he has spent a lot of money on it so has to live with it cos he has no money left,you know and i know this country is buggered,only the filthy rich have money,so why pay for it again,if its not right the tiler either should put it all right and then maybe take a cut or just not go back and lose the money.
Personally i get shut of him,live with the other bathroom and get someone right to dp the rest :smilewinkgrin:

 

[tonyfaestoney]

spot on alli...

Ok ok. Last time I am posting. As I said I have had a massive amount of work being done on the house. At no point did the tiler say pay me for the first bathroom before I start the 2nd? It was a case of I asked the tiler to complete the 2 and never thought of paying half way through??? It was my own fault for not being observant enough on the first bathroom, he finished this and went onto second the same day. I am not saying there is anything majorly wrong with the first one, just poor finishing but I have not made too much of a fuss about this.

With regards to second bathroom it would be fair to say he laid out wrong. Along with the window problem, the ceiling line, there are also parts of bathroom where tiles don't line up. These issues I was not aware of until he got up to the window and the ceiling. The first wall looked perfect until he tiled the others and they didn't line up as best as they should. As I say never seen a tile laid in my life and as I also said the tiler is a really nice guy so I put my trust in him.

WHEN we both became aware of especially the window and ceiling situation we briefly discussed it was not right. He offered to knock £60 off! This was on friday and I came on here to seek advice. I then phoned him on the sunday before he returned on monday with the advice he needs to start second bathroom again. Before I mention this he said he had been thinking about it all weekend and HE WOULD not be charging me for EITHER bathroom. I said I would pay for first and he couldstart again on second at his expense. He said no it's ok, I don't want any payment as he had messed it up. He said he does not have time as he has other jobs to go to so could not start again until November.

Now at this point I am stuck, I know I can't get a local tiler for some time havung spoken to the plumber on this. So in order to have a functioning bathroom we had been waiting 3 months for, i asked if he could put up the remaining 2 rows of tiles on one wall and tiles arounf window. he agreed to this and this is what happended.

Now I did offer to pay for first bathroom but this was refused. I now feel this is the correct decision as I will need to pay a plumber to remove furniture again, tiler to remove all tiles and re-do the whole bathroom, then plumber to re-fit again. On my calculations this should amount to the around about the same amount if I had paid the tiler for both bathrooms.

So with this in mind what you are saying I should have paid the tiler for first and then I am out of pocket for re-doing the second???

I will remind you that it was the TILER who said he did not want paid for EITHER bathroom. I was happy and asked him to re-do bathroom and he would be apid for both. The TILER said he was too busy to do this so what am I supposed to do??? As somebody else on here said, he should have cancelled upcoming work, started again on second bathroom all at his expense. I would then be more than happy to pay for all work but this was not an option.

Now I have explained for the umteenth time, do you still think I should be paying him anything??? If I did it was going to leave me out of pocket for his own admission - poor workmanship, somehow I don't think so.

 

[Brian the Tile]

widler this whole thing stinks,even a bloke with bad eyes would know a good job from a bad one and i dont think that {as you say everybody is sticking up for the tiler} re read the posts and look into it,the sad thing is is that the lad who has done the job in the first place has not had his say on the matter ,and in my opinion the customer is not always right ,so the lad made mistakes,havent we all ,nothing that couldnt have been made right,if it was so bad he should have thrown him out in the first place dont let the man carry on with the second bathroom and then say its all crap, come on, as others have said also it stinks

 

[AliGage]

Ok ok. Last time I am posting. As I said I have had a massive amount of work being done on the house. At no point did the tiler say pay me for the first bathroom before I start the 2nd? It was a case of I asked the tiler to complete the 2 and never thought of paying half way through??? It was my own fault for not being observant enough on the first bathroom, he finished this and went onto second the same day. I am not saying there is anything majorly wrong with the first one, just poor finishing but I have not made too much of a fuss about this.

With regards to second bathroom it would be fair to say he laid out wrong. Along with the window problem, the ceiling line, there are also parts of bathroom where tiles don't line up. These issues I was not aware of until he got up to the window and the ceiling. The first wall looked perfect until he tiled the others and they didn't line up as best as they should. As I say never seen a tile laid in my life and as I also said the tiler is a really nice guy so I put my trust in him.

WHEN we both became aware of especially the window and ceiling situation we briefly discussed it was not right. He offered to knock £60 off! This was on friday and I came on here to seek advice. I then phoned him on the sunday before he returned on monday with the advice he needs to start second bathroom again. Before I mention this he said he had been thinking about it all weekend and HE WOULD not be charging me for EITHER bathroom. I said I would pay for first and he couldstart again on second at his expense. He said no it's ok, I don't want any payment as he had messed it up. He said he does not have time as he has other jobs to go to so could not start again until November.

Now at this point I am stuck, I know I can't get a local tiler for some time havung spoken to the plumber on this. So in order to have a functioning bathroom we had been waiting 3 months for, i asked if he could put up the remaining 2 rows of tiles on one wall and tiles arounf window. he agreed to this and this is what happended.

Now I did offer to pay for first bathroom but this was refused. I now feel this is the correct decision as I will need to pay a plumber to remove furniture again, tiler to remove all tiles and re-do the whole bathroom, then plumber to re-fit again. On my calculations this should amount to the around about the same amount if I had paid the tiler for both bathrooms.

So with this in mind what you are saying I should have paid the tiler for first and then I am out of pocket for re-doing the second???

I will remind you that it was the TILER who said he did not want paid for EITHER bathroom. I was happy and asked him to re-do bathroom and he would be apid for both. The TILER said he was too busy to do this so what am I supposed to do??? As somebody else on here said, he should have cancelled upcoming work, started again on second bathroom all at his expense. I would then be more than happy to pay for all work but this was not an option.

Now I have explained for the umteenth time, do you still think I should be paying him anything??? If I did it was going to leave me out of pocket for his own admission - poor workmanship, somehow I don't think so.

It's an interesting situation i must say. And there ARE valid points to BOTH sides of the debate.

I think a few people have requested that we can see pictures of the first bathroom. I think there would be an advantage of seeing it. It's difficult to gauge everything as a whole without all the information.

It seems very strange to me that your tiler is refusing to accept any pay at all. This screams to me immaturity, and not in a childlike sense, but in a business sense. I think a lot of the tradesman on this forum would agree with me if i said that MOST would sooner put something right and turn a smaller profit perhaps, than walk away leaving an unhappy customer.

The thing that is niggling me is your acceptance of the first bathroom. How bad is it? Other factors like how much you were being charge in the first place is a factor as well.
I understand what your saying and far from it do i feel you should be out of pocket. But regardless of errors on the first bathroom, if the work is acceptable i.e: your not getting the work re-done then i believe the "tiler" is entitled to a financial reward. Allbeit it should be discounted, maybe quite heavily. He maybe quite new to the trade so niavity and inexperience has become a factor. But we've all been wet behind the ears at some stage. His efforts should still be rewarded IMO if the end result is going to remain unchanged.

That being said, There is a lot to be said for checking references and ensure YOU have the right tradesman in to the the job you intend to pay for. So, without trying to get your back up, i think morally you have an obligation to pay something, not accept the embaressing statement of "you don't have to pay me". Like i said this says to me inexperience. He's proberbly petrified of any fallout and things the easiest way to get out of the situation is to cut his losses. I feel a little (not a lot) sorry for him. Perhaps you can direct him to this forum so he can defend himself, and maybe get some advice and help on how to get his business on the straight and narrow.

I think the only way inwhich it's fair not to pay himis IF you are that unsatisified that you get someone else in and pay them to fix the work. If this comes to less than what the tiler was owed, pay him the difference. But, you mentioned that someone stated before, and i believe it was myself. I personally think that the tiler should be back at yours before moving on to rectify your issues to an acceptable standard, at his cost. He then, and once your happy, should recieve full payment for both rooms.

 

[widler]

Right im out, can't be bothered with double standards

 

[Dan]

Just bumping some of the older popular (sometimes not so popular) threads. Probably wont be current discussion these days but I just need to do it. So just ignore the thread if it's not current for you.