tiling over chipboard floating floor! help needed

[ythan]

phil.......just seen you last post......hey,.......so you're a conviction tiler.....always right .........
WoW.

 

[ythan]

whitebeam.................what makes you say that? No, i'm purely interested in the art and science of of tiling.

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whitebeam.................what makes you say that? No, i'm purely interested in the art and science of of tiling.

 

[CJ]

:dizzy2:

 

[Pebbs]

Just seen this thread, and really not very impressed with the snide petty remarks aimed at one of the most experienced tradesman in this field. The fact is simply this, tiling over chipboard is never advisable in any shape or form. But simply at the end of the day, if you want to run with it, on your head be it. It has to rank as one of the top ten bad practices, and there are many reasons for this, which have been stated time and time again on this forum.

If you do not wish to take advice from trusted advisors, then do not ask, but then again do not ask for a solution to a problem that could arise further down the road.

Pebbs

 

[White Room]

whitebeam.................what makes you say that? No, i'm purely interested in the art and science of of tiling.

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whitebeam.................what makes you say that? No, i'm purely interested in the art and science of of tiling.

You seem intent on picking faults on tilers posts but what you have realise these guys are doing this day in and day out and have pick up the pieces from amateurs when jobs go wrong.

 

[Perry]

And how many people's hard earned money some who carnt really afford to do it twice and the grief these educated people cause glad I didn't have much of a education

 

[AliGage]

hmmmm, i think i see your point......just....... you don't like wickes. a reputable company.

Wickes.........reputable.........lol. I use them if i need the odd bit or bob. There "trade" mumbo jumbo they put in there adverts is just publicity. They are a DIY company and nothing more. The products like the adhesive pictured above are aimed at the DIY market.

I've had to work in conjunction with Wickes on a lot of kitchen and bathroom installs. Reputable, professional, quality are three words i would not label Wickes with.

 

[Perry]

Let's just say 23000 hits and you get 23000 hits that's 46000 hits lets be kind to you and say 10 pent failure how much damage have you done if you aren't the same person

 

[Bathfix Bob]

I have a small floating floor to tile in a downstairs WC the size of the room is around 6x3ft. The whole of downstairs is laminate floor and I've cut the laminate floor out of the WC with a Mulitmaster under the door to reveal the chipboard underneath.

The house is only 16 years old, under the chipboard there is around 40mm of polystyrene on top of screed. The chipboard feels solid enough but I suppose on the edges there is a small amount of movement, my plan is to go ahead on this one seen as though its a small room and start by fixing L brackets maybe on the edges?? to secure the floor to the wall and then one single piece 18mm ply screwed and glued at 100mm centres and then glued and screwed Hardiebacker on top . Then the ceramic tiles, customer is fine with a step.

Surely this will be fine in this WC? I will take the small risk but the customer has been warned.

 

[Rossymcg]

Well when I typed in floating chipboard floor in google images there were diagrams of the chipboard with joists underneath thats why I asked the question could you just screw the chipboard down to the beams below to make the floor solid enough to tile on!

For the avoidance of any doubt, a floating floor is ridged insulation on top of a damp proof membrane, wih chipboard decking on top of that,no fixings.
if the customer is willing to pay, the chipboard and insulation can come up and then be screeded, but you lose the insulation or you can rip up again then baton out the floor fixing down the batons to the block and beam, insulate between the batons and re chipboard or ply followed by cement board glued and screwed,
thats what I do any how,

 

[Matt]

I don't understand why you need a chippy to lay plastic ply as it's easy to lay and cuts with a trusty stanly knife, and works well on floors with slight movement, I find it a lot better than detra mat

 

[Tabby Cranks]

The two big issues with tiling floating floors, is one, the type of insulation used (is it rigid enough to take a tiled finish?), and two, the type of chipboard. Unfortunately when it comes to tiling them, 99% of the time nobody seems to be able to give the tiler the information he needs! which is why most Tilers (including me) won't touch them.

you can stick your plastic ply (why somebody would is beyond me), your Ditra mat, even overlay it with 18mm plywood, but you still have a floating floor. If your insulation is not rigid enough, and may compress over time, you'll have problems somewhere down the line.

 

[tommytonguedj]

For the avoidance of any doubt, a floating floor is ridged insulation on top of a damp proof membrane, wih chipboard decking on top of that,no fixings.
if the customer is willing to pay, the chipboard and insulation can come up and then be screeded, but you lose the insulation or you can rip up again then baton out the floor fixing down the batons to the block and beam, insulate between the batons and re chipboard or ply followed by cement board glued and screwed,
thats what I do any how,

Hi Rossymcg, I am just in the process now of removing the floating floor started yesterday i have all materials to hand apart from my no more ply which i will order when i have the frame and plywood down, Just a quick question how do you fix your 4X2 timber to the block & beam? As some peiple suggest just packers and gripfill but the majority reccomend reinforced angle brackets. What would be your usual method. Thanks Tommy

 

[Rossymcg]

I drill straight through the 4x2 and use a concrete self tapping fixing then foam fix under between packers but I also put 4" dpm under the timber to prevent damp passing up and through

 

[mike1979]

Just seen this post And found it very interesting I have little knowledge about floating floor I priced a job up a few months ago half was apparently a floating floor some was screed and the rest concrete looked a right state so I walked away and said no thanks apparently it's been tiled now just wondering what state it's in

 

[CJ]

Just walked away from another floating floor.

when I first went to look at the job, the whole area had laminate down, on top of the usual green underlay fibre boards. Customer assured me the substrate was screed.

Big job as well (75m) although only??? About 20-25m was the floater.......but big enough to actually see the floor flexing when the dog walked across it. (Now laminate/under felt removed)

Tiles where special order only.......and have just had a phone call from supplier to say that there is a "restocking charge" of 20% which is going to cost the customer around £500 to send back.

whilst work isn't plentiful at the moment........my head STILL says no. Even with an extra £500 to overboard with hardi and 2 part addy.......which I'm not even sure they would accept (even though I still may walk)

This evenings phone call is going to be interesting??

 

[Qwerty]

Good luck!

 

[Andy Allen]

What tiles are they using?

 

[CJ]

What tiles are they using?

450 Porcelain.

 

[Andy Allen]

I've tiled a few.....only small cloakrooms though, used bal single part fast flex, bal grout with gt1 admix......don't know about 25m2 though.....different ball game...

 

[CJ]

I've tiled a few.....only small cloakrooms though, used bal single part fast flex, bal grout with gt1 admix......don't know about 25m2 though.....different ball game...

Same here......couple of very small floaters, nothing on this size.

 

[TJ Smiler]

I tiled a 19ft hallway for a Brazilian couple about five years ago, that was T&G green chipboard, i used Bal Fastflex and have not heard that there are any problems. You could see the floor move as you walked across it (before tiles went down) i decided to give it a go (everything was explained to the customer before you all start slaughtering me) on the basis that the area being tiled was not very wide, standard sort of hallway about 4-5ft so i only really had to worry about movement across the length of the floor. Don't know about your 25m2 longer and wider area but i can tell you that after tiling with fastflex you could see the slightest movement of the tiles as you walked on it, used bal wide joint grout mixed 1/1 with GT1 and like i say i have herd nothing from the customer. Not for one second suggesting you should get on with it, just wanted to tell my story rrr: but that fastflex is pretty amazing stuf.

 

[White Room]

So's the price :yikes:

 

[TJ Smiler]

So's the price :yikes:

Yeah you aint wrong there mate, 45 notes a pop....... Hardly ever use it now. Ardex 7001 or Webber's 2part are much better value now

 

[White Room]

Yeah you aint wrong there mate, 45 notes a pop....... Hardly ever use it now. Ardex 7001 or Webber's 2part are much better value now

I was on a job and the guy who lived there bought a bag for £70 notes....